Davie P Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 I see Sturgeon has announced a referendum in May if SNP wins the upcoming election. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jan/24/scotland-independence-referendum-nicola-sturgeon-snp-wins-may- It seems likely that the SNP will will the election, and most polls indicate a majority of voters are in favour of independence too. I expect the Brexit bunfight and Sturgeon's better handling of Covid than Johnson will further swing the scales. Independence has never looked more likely. I'm heartened to note that it is being promoted as an 'advisory' referendum from the outset. Brexit was also advisory but many pro-Brext politicians either failed to understand that or purposely tried to mislead people. So even if the referendum returns a 'yes' majority, it'll only be the beginning of a process.... It'll be an interesting few months if you're interested in politics! Roachmill 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReeseTheDundonian Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 The Republic of Scotland Sounds brilliant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue beetle Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 (edited) Scotland has a huge hole in their finances which has to be topped up by the English every year. Which is also where the money came from via the EU for all the so called benefits of membership we keep hearing about. The SNP are not keen on salmon farming , oil, gas, fracking, or fishing. except to give away our grounds to the EU. They seem to want to turn our farm land into some sort of theme park. Our heavy industries are a shadow of their former selves . The defence basses would all have to close and the holy grail of reentry into the EU will be vetoed by the Spanish because of Catalonia. Not to mention the fact that they do not need another economic basket case added to their now dwindling budget. Scotland is also the sick man of Europe and the drugs capital of well the world with all the extra social costs that comes with it. There is probably more but i feel ive made my point. And the question i have to ask myself is where is the money going to come from to pay for independence. Also the clamour for indie ref 2 is mostly being driven by a hatred of Boris johnson. But he is a here today gone tomorrow politician . And Scotland it seems to me will be struggling to balance the books long long after he has gone. Oh i forgot to mention Scotlands share of the national debt. Edited January 24, 2021 by blue beetle After thought angelpie, Roachmill and Arfski 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davie P Posted January 24, 2021 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 6 minutes ago, blue beetle said: Scotland has a huge hole in their finances which has to be topped up by the English every year. Which is also where the money came from via the EU for all the so called benefits of membership we keep hearing about. With respect, this is a rather simplistic political take on what is a complex economic relationship. From what you're saying, England is basically subsidising Scotland and (up till now) the EU. However, there are many factors to consider - spending per capita, cost of living, GDP, budget deficits - you name it. Some of this is know, but much of it is conjecture. Similar arguments were made from Brexit, but the fact of the matter is that the true financial picture would only start to become clear once the divorce negations have taken place and the various and independent economies have (re)established. The true picture wouldn't be know for years. 11 minutes ago, blue beetle said: The SNP are not keen on salmon farming , oil, gas, fracking, or fishing. except to give away our grounds to the EU. They seem to want to turn our farm land into some sort of theme park. I'm not sure I follow. Why/how are the SNP 'not keen' on Scotland's major industries? 14 minutes ago, blue beetle said: Our heavy industries are a shadow of their former selves . ...and have been in decline for many decades in many western countries, largely as a result of cheaper labour and production costs elsewhere in the world. It would be a push to blame the SNP for that. angelpie 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post BigMouth Posted January 24, 2021 Popular Post Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 (edited) If Scotland is such a drain on England how come Westminster is so keen to keep hold of us? Independence can't come soon enough. If we had it now our fish could be sold in Europe, because Scotland voted against leaving the EU. "The clamour for Independence" has been going for much longer than Johnson has been in number 10. Scots don't want to be ruled by the Tories. It's as simple as that, and you can hardly blame them after the balls-up Johnson seems to be making of everything. Next step reducing workers rights - oh joy! Oh! And no nuclear bases in Scotland sounds like result. Edited January 24, 2021 by BigMouth Arfski, George. and angelpie 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peeriebryan Posted January 24, 2021 Report Share Posted January 24, 2021 @Davie P, I hope you don't mind but we added a poll to your post. We used the same wording as the 2014 referendum and added an undecided option too. Davie P and Fjool 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windwalker Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 10 hours ago, BigMouth said: If Scotland is such a drain on England how come Westminster is so keen to keep hold of us? Independence can't come soon enough. If we had it now our fish could be sold in Europe, because Scotland voted against leaving the EU. "The clamour for Independence" has been going for much longer than Johnson has been in number 10. Scots don't want to be ruled by the Tories. It's as simple as that, and you can hardly blame them after the balls-up Johnson seems to be making of everything. Next step reducing workers rights - oh joy! Oh! And no nuclear bases in Scotland sounds like result. I really wish folk would stop thinking that they speak for all Scots when they make statements. ”independence can’t come soon enough” ha ha, if you get your independence, she will hand it straight to the EU. Scotland will be shredded by them. But keep believing all this guff about being independent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urabug Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 Nichola Sturgeon would be well advised to take a good look at Jo Swinson's election results and why they turned out the way they did. It's very wrong to assume everyone is thinking the same way as you,as was proved when Jo lost her seat and leadership. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roachmill Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 Here's a question - hands up those who realise the SNP and whoever is leading them will become effectively irrelevant in the event of Scotland becoming independent. Those who hoist her up as a reason to stay with the UK really do need to just not bother until they've had a long hard look past the end of their noses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMouth Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 2 hours ago, Windwalker said: I really wish folk would stop thinking that they speak for all Scots when they make statements. ”independence can’t come soon enough” ha ha, if you get your independence, she will hand it straight to the EU. Scotland will be shredded by them. But keep believing all this guff about being independent. There seems to be a fair few upset with being out of the EU. They all seem to be saying that they were lied to. Fishermen with catches they can’t land, hauliers with trucks stuck at ports, and even before the ports, businesses with mounds of paperwork they have no idea of how to fill in. Frictionless trade, sunlit uplands, another Tory economic miracle? Aye, that will be right. Arfski 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 5 minutes ago, BigMouth said: There seems to be a fair few upset with being out of the EU. They all seem to be saying that they were lied to. Fishermen with catches they can’t land, hauliers with trucks stuck at ports, and even before the ports, businesses with mounds of paperwork they have no idea of how to fill in. Frictionless trade, sunlit uplands, another Tory economic miracle? Aye, that will be right. I wouldn't say we were lied to, but anyone with a modicum of common sense would have realised that the fishing in particular (despite the rhetoric) was always going to be on the table. Don't you think that the current obstacles you quoted just might be temporary, after all, they work both ways. ?? Anyway, if they can't buy our fish, then we should start eating it ourselves.. Just remember that during the last little unpleasant interlude with Europe, the only thing that wasn't rationed was fish and chips... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMouth Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 We were lied to. Frictionless trade was just one of them. No downsides, only upsides was another. There were many more. There are no obstacles to bringing items into the UK. Trucks are just being waved through unchecked so that there is not more chaos at the ports than there already is. Some of this is temporary, but vet certificates, just one example, won’t be. The red tape isn’t going anywhere either. I would be happier eating more fish, especially if it gets cheaper. Arfski 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 (edited) I would agree that there might be to much red tape in the process but, don't you think that it is the responsibilty of exporters (of all kinds) to complete the relevant paperwork properly before they hit the brick walls at the ports ? Bleating about it doesn't help if they are not properly prepared. Edited January 25, 2021 by Colin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urabug Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 Most of the restaurants and hospitality sector are closed or restricted just now,here in the UK and throughout Europe so who is buying our fish and meat . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMouth Posted January 25, 2021 Report Share Posted January 25, 2021 (edited) The paperwork is the red tape Colin! It was red tape that we didn’t have when we were EU members. The lack of preparation was down to the Government springing the final decision at the last minute on the poor exporters. The Government are now advising Uk companies to open branch offices in the EU to make it easier, so they lay off staff here and take on staff in the EU countries. You couldn’t make this up! No-one is buying our fish, that why so many of GB’s boats are tied up. Presumably the meat is still walking around the fields! Edited January 25, 2021 by BigMouth Addition Roachmill 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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