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Scottish Independence Referendum 2021


Scottish Independence Poll  

45 members have voted

  1. 1. Should Scotland be an independent country?

    • Yes
      22
    • No
      19
    • Undecided
      4


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3 hours ago, Evil Inky said:

^ Is there any evidence that unregistered donations are being made to the SNP? Much of the issues about the donation to decorate the PM's flat was that it wasn't registered: in other words they were trying to keep it secret. And why would they want to keep it secret, I wonder? :ponders:

I might be wrong, but I thought he did register £58k. However to be clear I think all politicians need to be more upfront regarding donations etc.

I would assume there’s similar issues in all parties, have been for years and no doubt will be in future. As for the SNP we might never know as they tend to have someone taking minutes at meetings, then immediately destroy them.

 

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2 hours ago, hakama said:

Thank you Windwalker that was very nice of you. I am sure that many more people think along the same lines but are afraid to say anything because if you do you will get the PC police at your door or you will be labeled . It is a way to stop people saying things that the authorities do not like. There are none so blind as those who do not want to see. Do have a serious think about all this Roachmill. There is no shame in changing ones mind.

Hakama

my experience on here is if you dare to question anything about the SNP, several will come at you, but if you ask them to clarify, provide information or justify etc, they rarely do, with a few exceptions.

Where some are concerned, their modus operandi seems to be, to try and shut you up and rather than discuss the issue they will say, such and such is worse etc. They cannot see any wrong doing by anyone in the SNP. Luckily there are a few SNP supporters who will have a good discussion and I appreciate they have their views as I do. Of course they are wrong though ;-) :-)

 

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The UK is over £2 Trillion pounds in debt,if Scotland were to go independent it would have to take with it a share of this debt .

Where is our wealth ,the oil industry is gradually being phased out in favour of reducing our demands on fossil fuel and this was an industry that provided a livelyhood for thousands of people.

Someone remarked that the "green" industry would support all those jobs but I cannot see that able to pay the wages that were available in the oil industry.,or anywhere near the number of jobs.

Also every litre of fuel oil that is sold has a very high rate of tax ,as the sale of fuel deminishes so will the revenue from that tax.

The SNP wants to kick Trident out,this will also be a kick in the teeth to many of those employed to maintain it, and how does the SNP intend to provide our military presence that is necessary to keep us all safe.

Fishing will IMHO become even more important to us as the years go by,but if the SNP rejoin the EU then all our fishing rights will once again go .Now we are out of the EU as time passes we will hopefully gain our waters back to ourselves or at least have more control who can fish them.

Scotland cannot survive on whisky and wind turbines,and the income from a few tourists, we need the support of our neighbours and they need us together it is best,who wants a border between us .

And what about the Scottish Pound,will we all be losers as the pound changes to the Euro.

Think the best we can do is bide together.

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Posted (edited)
52 minutes ago, Urabug said:

The UK is over £2 Trillion pounds in debt,if Scotland were to go independent it would have to take with it a share of this debt .

Moot point. If we stay in the UK we have a debt, if we leave we have a debt, and almost every country has debt anyway. Furthermore, it depends on how the settlement is calculated if we leave. A relatively regularly used method (for example, in the case of post Soviet or Czech and Slovak republics separations) is done per head of population, which would see Scotland come out with a considerably lower level than England.

52 minutes ago, Urabug said:

Scotland cannot survive on whisky and wind turbines,and the income from a few tourists, we need the support of our neighbours and they need us together it is best,who wants a border between us .

This is quite a frivolous thing to say, although I'm sure it was done for effect rather than actually believing that Scotland's economy is based on whiskey, wind turbines and tourists.

However, it does get a bit wearing to read comments such as these that simplify, trivialise and talk our economy down - presumably inn an attempt to mislead people into thinking our economy is less buoyant than it actually is.

For example, in 2020 Edinburgh was ranked as the 4th largest financial centre in Europe and the 13th largest financial centre internationally (source). That's quite a remarkable statistic that bodes well for an independent Scotland within a modern, global economy, if independence is the path we want to take. 
 

1 hour ago, Windwalker said:

Hakama

my experience on here is if you dare to question anything about the SNP, several will come at you, but if you ask them to clarify, provide information or justify etc, they rarely do, with a few exceptions.

Where some are concerned, their modus operandi seems to be, to try and shut you up and rather than discuss the issue they will say, such and such is worse etc. They cannot see any wrong doing by anyone in the SNP. Luckily there are a few SNP supporters who will have a good discussion and I appreciate they have their views as I do. Of course they are wrong though ;-) :-)

 

I'm open minded about Independence and all too often it seems to me that folk have long ago made up their minds about which 'side' they're on. Having a closed mindset like that is very unhelpful when one of the most important decisions any of us are likely to take will soon be upon us. 

Edited by Davie P
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And what about the funding required to keep our NHS, Education,Universities, Colledges Pensions, County Councils, and all the many other benifits and grants.

Folks investments ,agriculture and all its complexities.

At the moment many different companys communications, Health, Aviation, merchant Marine, etc etc share training facilities .

If anyone thought brexit negotiations were complicated wait until the divorce between Scotland and England starts.

The only folk who will really benifit from all this will be the legal profession.

"Whar is aw da money coming fae"

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Quote

Whar is aw da money coming fae"

It’s quiet simple. And even a unionist lik me can see it.

fir a start Scotland only costs about 10% to run as England.

The different countries raise money by taxing their population.

income tax, vat, corporation tax, inheritance tax etc etc etc.

We already pay for our 10% so that’s where the money comes from to pay for our portion of NHS, education etc.

noo there might be savings to be made by buying in bulk, ie as part of a larger state, so in the short term there will a level of panic about money, but nothing insurmountable.

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7 hours ago, Wheelsup said:

fir a start Scotland only costs about 10% to run as England.

It's probably quite true to say that Scotland only costs 10% to run as England. Do you know why I believe that is? The number of people living in Scotland is pretty close to being 10% of the number in England.

But Westminster benefits from our oil, and never has the courtesy to even say thanks.

Edited by George.
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9 hours ago, Wheelsup said:

It’s quiet simple. And even a unionist lik me can see it.

fir a start Scotland only costs about 10% to run as England.

The different countries raise money by taxing their population.

income tax, vat, corporation tax, inheritance tax etc etc etc.

We already pay for our 10% so that’s where the money comes from to pay for our portion of NHS, education etc.

noo there might be savings to be made by buying in bulk, ie as part of a larger state, so in the short term there will a level of panic about money, but nothing insurmountable.

It’s kinda lik da difference between splittin da bill or aabody buyin dir own denner. When a group o folk split da bill dirs always some folk dat end up disgruntled because dey think dey’ve paid mair than they expected, (especially if dey didna hae wine or a starter!) but if aabody buys dir own denner dey get whit dey want and whit dey can afford.

I dee da HS2 rail link and Trident lik Scotland payin fur England’s wine and starter. Scotland might no be able to afford da steak and truffles, but we can still get a good feed fae da Harbour Cafe!

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All sounds good until the living standards between all the different nations become disproportional,will we in Scotland put up with paying more tax, say than our neighbours,different levels of health service, or different standards of living.

Pension rates could be very different for folk in England,Wales and Northern ireland to those in Scotland.

We will not have a national health service because everything "National" will be no more, we will have a Scottish Health service and look at that track record so far.

Education will be different ,will it be better . 

Grass is always greener on the other side of the fence.

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All du really seems to be sayin is dat things will be different. And dat wid be da whole point. Things wid be different - some better, some worse - but Scotland tends to vote fur left leaning parties and England tends to vote fur right leaning parties. If we went wir seperate ways den Scotland wid liklee hae higher taxes and better social services, England wid hae lower taxes and mair reliance on public service outsourcing tae private companies. For example, if you towt dat giving awaa aa da Covid contracts tae private companies rather than investing da same money in da NHS wis da right thing tae do, den vote tae keep da union and tie wis tae English policies!

I’m lucky enough to earn a higher dan average wage and hiv no problem we payin higher taxes if it means da country I live in is mair equitable.

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2 hours ago, Muckle Oxters said:

I’m lucky enough to earn a higher dan average wage and hiv no problem we payin higher taxes if it means da country I live in is mair equitable.

I wonder how many people say that in public but vote for more 'selfishly' in the privacy of the voting booth. Thanks not an accusation BTW @Muckle Oxters. I'm sure you're a selfless pillar of the community!

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An independent Scotland could learn a lot from the Scandinavians. Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Finland and Iceland all seem to have the balance between free market capitalism, a comprehensive welfare state and a unionised workforce spot on. Taxes are higher but quality of life from cradle to grave is streets ahead of what we have as part of the UK.

All prosperous small to medium sized independent countries. Some of them even have massively populated countries on their southern border, just like Scotland. I bet if you asked a Dane or Finn if they would prefer to be a Northern region of Germany or Russia they would laugh in your face and think you were on drugs.

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