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The Xmas Shoe Box


BigMouth
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I think that the idea of filling a shoe box with gifts for a child is laudable and to be applauded. The act of giving to those with less than us is a wonderful gesture, but I have a real problem with the fact that the organisations put a bible in the box before it is sent out.

 

Christians never seem to understand that as lovely as they imagine they are, their religious views may offend others.

 

Will you be filling a box for children this year and do you mind if a bible is added to your gift?

 

I wanted to add a Buddha figure but that would be removed so why is the bible the right book whereas the Koran would be wrong?

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Love Thy Neighbour.

 

Yes. It is totally wrong. I would strongly suggest that anybody suggesting to take part in one of these schemes boycott it entirely and go for something that has no religious background to it (There must be one....is there?).

 

Nobody should support something that is so extremely against free speech. Religion = War. Unfortunately it is a fact and until someone comes up with a way for everybody to live in harmony it always will be.

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There is a very, very thin and almost always vague line between "spreading the word" and "ramming the word down throats by any and all available means, and repeatedly doing it until the victim stops fighting back", the act is very laudable, the propoganda it's being hi-jacked by is far from it.

 

By all means include in the gift basic information of any orgnisation etc and their affiliations that made the gift possible, but do it in a neutral and unobtrusive manner. I may be one of the most un-PC folk around, and wouldn't normally be bothered about something like this, but I do find the force feeding of any doctrine, whoever does it, and whatever the doctrine is, both objectionble and distasteful.

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I'd have to say there's a slight conflict of ideas here. I don't really see how including a bible is "ramming the doctrine down kids throats". PAYING kids for correct answers as is the current practice at Sunday schools is ramming it down their throats.

 

Inclusion of a bible in the box may seem objectionable but i am confident that the majority of them will end up in the bin or propping up table legs. Those that are read will be read by those who wish to find out what ideology prompted people to give stuff away for nothing in the first place.

 

Unfortunately us wonderful non-practising non-christians find it easy to fault those that are, but seem to fail to provide alternative non-christian gift boxes. Or make my day and prove me wrong.

 

Religion may "cause war" but so does apathy, and we can't go banning apathy can we, well i won't anyway.....cos i can't be arsed. :wink:

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Those that are read will be read by those who wish to find out what ideology prompted people to give stuff away for nothing in the first place.

 

This is the problem. A lot of people will give. A lot of people will receive. A lot of receiving people will think that this must be the only way to go. These good people that are providing supplies are good bible studying people. Many aren't but as you say there are maybe sod all other charities that provide this service.

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I'd have to say there's a slight conflict of ideas here. I don't really see how including a bible is "ramming the doctrine down kids throats". PAYING kids for correct answers as is the current practice at Sunday schools is ramming it down their throats.

 

Purely a personal opinion on this, but my feelings on it is that in this day and age something as unique and personal as an individual's religious beliefs, should be left alone for them to go out there and seek out the one that best suits them, and because they feel a "need" to have something of the sort in their life, not because they feel in some way pressured that it is something they "should" have in their life. There's a wide range out there, very visible and very accessible, let people find the one they are looking for when they feel they want to find it, and not try and sneak one particular sort in like a Trojan Horse as the one giving rise to the topic of this thread would seem to be to me, or have one pitted against the other by doorstep of street "salespeople" like double glazing or insurance, it's not becoming of the product being pushed.

 

I do agree about Sunday Schools though, I would hope it was through ignorance and lack of thought than any sort of intent, but some of the practices common in them over the years can only have caused more people to gain a very negative view of christianity, the church and religion in general, than they ever converted to it.

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is it really any different to coca cola including some free bottles and logo covered textbooks and pencils with the new 'world according to fizzy drinks' yearbook for schoolkids? the church is a business like most things. i don't doubt there's well meaning in there somewhere, but it's only goood busined sense to slap a logo on it. all the emergency aid you see on the telly has USA clearly labelled on it. i suspect none of this stuff is any more a gift than an investment. :cry:

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........Unfortunately us wonderful non-practising non-christians find it easy to fault those that are, but seem to fail to provide alternative non-christian gift boxes. Or make my day and prove me wrong......

 

Not much excites me these days, it's probably just cynicism, but I got really excited about the idea of these boxes last year and spent a couple of days working out how I could maximise the space to the best effect. Someone tipped me off about the religious angle and it was an instant turn-off. If I give something I do so freely not to try to get some message across. If there is a message it is that I care about the recipient. You don't have to be religious to care about people.

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I think that since the box is for Christmas which happens to be a Christian celebration then it is not too surprising for it to have some religious input as well as the gifts in the box. As has been mentioned already, the recipient has the choice of reading the book or using it to light the fire if they want. I don't see the problem with including a bible in the box as the recipient will not be forced to read and believe it before acceping the gift.

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I think that since the box is for Christmas which happens to be a Christian celebration then it is not too surprising for it to have some religious input as well as the gifts in the box. As has been mentioned already, the recipient has the choice of reading the book or using it to light the fire if they want. I don't see the problem with including a bible in the box as the recipient will not be forced to read and believe it before acceping the gift.

 

A bit of care is still needed. Possesion of a bible is surely still illegal in some countries and very much frowned on in others. A shoe box containing a passport to jail is not a good idea.

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I think that since the box is for Christmas which happens to be a Christian celebration then it is not too surprising for it to have some religious input as well as the gifts in the box. As has been mentioned already, the recipient has the choice of reading the book or using it to light the fire if they want. I don't see the problem with including a bible in the box as the recipient will not be forced to read and believe it before acceping the gift.

 

A bit of care is still needed. Possesion of a bible is surely still illegal in some countries and very much frowned on in others. A shoe box containing a passport to jail is not a good idea.

 

Just a couple of observations:

 

:?: Surely these boxes you are all discussing will be being delivered to missionary outposts where there are already established Christians etc. and will be handed over by Christians to Christians (or ones in the making)?

 

As Waddersty mentions .. the very fact that these boxes are being delivered at "Christmas" surely gives the game away, no? Christmas is a celebration on the "Christian" calendar! It surely can't be a massive shock that this is also subjectively the most important mark on that calendar hence a Christmas box surely would have a Christian bible whanged into it rather than the Torah, Razzle, Playboy or whatever!?!?

 

*sigh*

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trout wrote

Surely these boxes you are all discussing will be being delivered to missionary outposts where there are already established Christians etc. and will be handed over by Christians to Christians (or ones in the making)?
Oh I do hope not.....surely the idea is for them to go to needy children rather than being used as a bribe to convert.
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This was in another thread:

 

I note - with some disquiet - that Billy Graham's Samaritans Purse outfit are setting up Operation Christmas Child in Shetland this year.

 

I've come across this outfit at my daughters school down south over the past couple of years and having looked up something of its background, I'd urge anyone considering donating to it to do the same.

 

The following site outlines some concerns and presents secular alternatives for those who'd like their giving to come without evangelism attached.

 

http://humfam.humgroups.org.uk/Samaritans_Purse.html

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