Drugs in Shetland

[Shetland_boys]

lmao , i wouldnt change it, its cool. p.s drugs r bad

[mhutch]

mhutch a tadge of trolling there old chap. ps you do know what the name mhutch means don't you.

 

i would have a fair idea, its my first initial and half my surname, unless you can slander it in some way? be my guest

not slander just the word is also slang for a person who is proud of his penis size and likes to be public about it.

a slight change of your user name maybe wise.

 

its hardly weather to be taking him out , luckily hes attatched so you n your junkie buddys couldnt steal him so easy

[paulb]

were have i said i was in favour of drugs. the sensible treatment of addicts yes but not in favour of drugs at all. methadone is worse than the drug its replacing.

 

the treatment of an addict needs carefull planning. if we don't treat there addiction we get lots of dead shetlanders. are you in favour of people dying young.

[mhutch]

were have i said i was in favour of drugs. the sensible treatment of addicts yes but not in favour of drugs at all. methadone is worse than the drug its replacing.

 

the treatment of an addict needs carefull planning. if we don't treat there addiction we get lots of dead shetlanders. are you in favour of people dying young.

 

if you spent less time reading foreign slang dictionarys and more time reading the thread then you might see am totally in favour of removing the supply i.e. no heroin , no junkies

[Fjool]

^ If removing supply were possible then I'd agree with your point of view. I just don't think that effectively removing supply is a feasible option and whilst this approach is pursued the problems are made worse, not better.

 

Two of the most serious problems with heroin use are addiction (and associated crime) and risk of overdose. Unfortunately both of these problems are exaggerated by prohibition.

 

Partial prohibition, such as we have now, is counter-productive. It has to be 100% effective to succeed.

[xoni]

^^ Well no s**t Sherlock, what do you think the law has been trying to do all this time? One step forwards , two steps back thats exactly how it works with current policy, the police are at a loss and know they have no chance of ever winning.

 

I have children, I want to see them bought up in a safer enviroment. Illegal = dangerous where drugs are concerned for a multitude of different reasons... from the way they are mixed , to the supply and transportation , the alure of the dark side for our young folk, to the methods used to obtain them and the crimes created by this ..keeping it underground opens the door for the very shady characters you are speaking about not the victims and yes I use the word victims.

 

Please dont assume all addicts were born on the street, chances are you likely live down the road from one or two , normal middle class people with the money to support thier unfortunate habit. The people you speak of these 'losers' and 'wasters' have made a bad choice in thier life to go down this path, one bad choice, have you never made a bad choice? I surely have and I've paid for it , and they pay for it too, in the worst of ways.

 

Currently your way of thinking is the law, but blatently your way of thinking is failing dismally, so do you carry on with something thats failing dismally or do you try something else?

[ArabiaTerra]

were have i said i was in favour of drugs. the sensible treatment of addicts yes but not in favour of drugs at all. methadone is worse than the drug its replacing.

 

the treatment of an addict needs carefull planning. if we don't treat there addiction we get lots of dead shetlanders. are you in favour of people dying young.

 

if you spent less time reading foreign slang dictionarys and more time reading the thread then you might see am totally in favour of removing the supply i.e. no heroin , no junkies

Removing the supply is exactly what the Government has been trying to do for the last 40 years!

 

It_hasn't_worked.

 

Now please, please provide some evidence that doing more of the same, only harder, will make the slightest bit of difference.

 

There are countries which have the death penalty(Thailand) for dealers, and they have been unable to stem the rise in drug usage, where on earth do you get the idea that tougher jail sentences will have the slightest impact?

[Ghostrider]

The two lots of lyrics below were written by an (allegedly) alcoholic smackhead 30 or so years ago.

 

How and why some folk get in too deep with the substance of their choice hardly matters, folk do. Some, like the lyrics writer, know where they are and when to want out. Some don't know, and don't want to know.

 

Society and the law is badly failing those who are in it, know they're in too far, and need to get out. The current situation allows them no real viable exit, so they continue, effectively making the overall problem all the greater.

 

As Fjool has pointed out, prohibition has to by 100%, or extremely near that to be of any use. What we have is prohibition of less than 1%, a pointless and extremely wasteful smoke and mirrors performance.

 

Society and the law has totally failed to protect anyone from being exposed to the currently prohibited substances, or restrict the supply of said substances in any meaningful way. The least they have an obligatuon to do now is provide a means to those who they failed to protect, who want to get back out, to be able to do so.

 

Yes, of course there will always be losers and wasters in any society, but they are by no means exclusively junkies, they're everywhere, from the simple tame home and garden couch potato TV addict, via the couch potato X Box addict etc.

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

"I've got to give it up I've got to give it up

That stuff

I've got to give it up I've got to give it up

That stuff

 

Tell my mama and tell my pa

That their fine young son didn't get far

He made it to the end of a bottle

Sitting in a sleazy bar

 

He tried hard but his spirit broke

He tried until he nearly choked

In the end he lost his

Bottle drinking alcohol

 

I've got to give it up I've got to give it up

That stuff

I've got to give it up I've got to give it up

That stuff

 

Tell my brother I tried to write and

Put pen to paper but I was frightened

I couldn't seem to get the words out right

Right quite right

 

Tell my sister I'm sinking slow

Now and again I powder my nose

In the end I lost my bottle

It smashed in a casbah

 

I've got to give it up I've got to give it up

That stuff

I've got to give it up I've got to give it up

That stuff

 

I've got to give it up I've got to give it up

That stuff

I've got to give it up I've got to give it up

That stuff

 

I've been messing with the heavy stuff

For a time I couldn't get enough

But I'm waking up and it's wearing off

Junk don't take you far

 

Tell my Mama I'm coming home

In my youth I'm getting older

And I think it's lost control

Mama I'm coming home

 

I've got to give it up I've got to give it up

That stuff

I've got to give it up I've got to give it up

That stuff"

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

"I took a line that leads you to the opium trail

Oriental eyes reveal the lies, deceit, betrayal

On this journey behold one who travels far

You called him fool but now you are

 

The wizard wanders through the world made from dreams

The splashing whirlpool drowns the frightened streams

Exotic dancers, flashing lancers, this mysterious space

The fanfare advances, the warlord falls from grace

 

It clears your pain

But It's got you claimed again, my love

You feel the need but it lets you bleed

You must concede, my love

 

No one to blame, no shame

You crave again and again, my love

No used to plead from you

It feeds on your greed, my love

 

I took a line that comes from the golden states of Shan

The smugglers trail that leads to the opium den

The Chinese connection refines to heroin

Depart the heart you crave again

 

It clears your pain

You soul is claimed again, my love

You feel the need, it lets you bleed

You must concede, my love

 

No one to blame, no shame

You crave again and again, my love

No use to plead

From you it feeds, my love"

[mhutch]

^ If removing supply were possible then I'd agree with your point of view. I just don't think that effectively removing supply is a feasible option and whilst this approach is pursued the problems are made worse, not better.

 

Two of the most serious problems with heroin use are addiction (and associated crime) and risk of overdose. Unfortunately both of these problems are exaggerated by prohibition.

 

Partial prohibition, such as we have now, is counter-productive. It has to be 100% effective to succeed.

 

Given that theres 3 profitable means of entry , by boat where theres plenty taking a "bung" or in the car boot , sumburgh less likely , and lets not forget Scatsta, then theres ample opportunity to squeeze the supply network. If its harder to get in the knock on effect is theres less to get , hence less supply to feed on. Condoning its supply usage and culture is to condone and support the muggings robbery theft and deciept that goes with it , count me out of that from the start

[Ghostrider]

^^ Aye, but.

 

Things have aready gone far too far for that approach to work very slick. So you lock down harder on entry points and that reduces supply, all good. But, what do you do with the smackheads already here? As the supply reduces so will the price rise in parallel, and those already hooked will go to any lengths to get their fix. In the short to medium term you'll create a situation where those muggings and robbery you don't want will be rife to cover the ever increasing cost of that days nectar. A situation which will last as long as it takes old Bill to catch up with all current smackheads as they one by one get sloppy or careless and desperate in their hunt for the readies their dealer needs. I don't think I want to be living in the middle of that going on, as it'll be quite an intense crime spree as long as it lasts.

[mhutch]

^^ Aye, but.

 

Things have aready gone far too far for that approach to work very slick. So you lock down harder on entry points and that reduces supply, all good. But, what do you do with the smackheads already here? As the supply reduces so will the price rise in parallel, and those already hooked will go to any lengths to get their fix. In the short to medium term you'll create a situation where those muggings and robbery you don't want will be rife to cover the ever increasing cost of that days nectar. A situation which will last as long as it takes old Bill to catch up with all current smackheads as they one by one get sloppy or careless and desperate in their hunt for the readies their dealer needs. I don't think I want to be living in the middle of that going on, as it'll be quite an intense crime spree as long as it lasts.

 

Chance i would be willing to take old bean , a good incentive for the public to become a bit more pro-active in cleaning up its standards

[Ghostrider]

^^ Let me ken aforehaund hit starts den. Im wantin ta ken da auld twal bore is weel cleaned an oiled, an I hae a guid roo o' shot lyin bye. Juist in case.

[shetlandpeat]

No one is condoning it. You will never stop it getting to the Isles, if they can get it into prison with the security they have there than what has a fenceless island group gonna do.

 

The only way is to treat it openly and as fairly as possible. Remove the dealers and their dodgy supply and let trained professionals monitor it.

 

Just out of interest, do you understand why opiates are more addictive than say cocaine. If you do you will understand partly why folks rob and steal to support the addiction, if there were no need to pay a dealer then the cash is not required.

 

This country has to be brave about this.

 

The savings will be quite unmeasurable in human terms as well, although I am sure someone could work out the savings to society.

[shetlandpeat]

 

Chance i would be willing to take old bean , a good incentive for the public to become a bit more pro-active in cleaning up its standards

 

Not with my safety, you are not taking any chances.

 

It will create even more crime.

 

An unmeasured risk is too much.

 

One more death is always too much, who ever it is.

[ArabiaTerra]

^ If removing supply were possible then I'd agree with your point of view. I just don't think that effectively removing supply is a feasible option and whilst this approach is pursued the problems are made worse, not better.

 

Two of the most serious problems with heroin use are addiction (and associated crime) and risk of overdose. Unfortunately both of these problems are exaggerated by prohibition.

 

Partial prohibition, such as we have now, is counter-productive. It has to be 100% effective to succeed.

 

Given that theres 3 profitable means of entry , by boat where theres plenty taking a "bung" or in the car boot , sumburgh less likely , and lets not forget Scatsta, then theres ample opportunity to squeeze the supply network. If its harder to get in the knock on effect is theres less to get , hence less supply to feed on. Condoning its supply usage and culture is to condone and support the muggings robbery theft and deciept that goes with it , count me out of that from the start

Right, let's see what this approach would really mean...

 

Strip search everyone who comes in through Sumburgh, Scatsta, Tingwall, off a boat in Lerwick, Scalloway, Cullivoe, Baltasound, Hamnavoe, Symbister, that pier where the Altaire docks, everyone who takes a small boat out of any marina in shetland (you don't know what nefarious characters they might be meeting out of sight of land), everyone who goes out in a boat from any private mooring, anywhere or who launches from any beach, anywhere.

 

Oh yeah, and then you'd have to search the tanker crews at Sullom, and the pilot and tug boat operators.

 

Then you'd have to open every letter or parcel passing through the Post Office, every container landed in Lerwick or Scalloway, you'd have to dismantle every electrical or electronic device, or anything else which might have drugs hidden in it, regardless of whether or not it was meant to come apart, you'd have to strip down to individual components every car, truck, tractor, digger or other piece of plant being landed on the island, you'd have to rip open every bag of salmon or animal feed, fertiliser, sand, seed, cement and sift through every other piece of bulk product being transported up here.

 

In addition, you'd have to mount a permanent 24hr watch on every beach, cove, geo, voe, and cliff in the islands to prevent outsiders from sneaking in with cargo. And after all that, you could still grow the stuff in any suitably equipped greenhouse on the islands.

 

And I am sure there are a dozen or more points of possible entry into these islands that I haven't covered.

 

Now, mhutch, are you willing to put up with what I've outlined above (never mind paying for it).