Complementary therapies

[Fjool]

^ I did, but I fell over.

 

...i'll get my coat.

 

What is this Zero Balancing?

[Njugle]

OoOoh, my web searches show me there's a practitioner that comes to Shetland. Sounds interesting. Might have to have a go at that.

[MJ]

Now I'd love a job title like Zero Ballancer.

It was so hard first time I met my daughter's best friend at school's Mum and she introduced herself as an Angel Theripist. The BF at the time was a true Seatoner and we both had to leave PDQ before we burst out laughing. She makes a decent living though, apparently she's one of the best around.

 

So is there a Zero Ballancer up here then? Where'd they train and for how long? Where'd they practice? And how much for half an hour?

[Guest posiedon]

Njugle

It is also practised at the GBH

sorry for the smile, but I always read GBH as "grevious bodily harm" oh the irony.

 

as advocated and practised by the consultant anaesthetist, who has his own scientific explanations as to how it works.

Would this be his explanation?

Acupuncture is based on the ancient Chinese theory that needles can be used to release the body's vital energy, or qi.

If not, maybe you could enlighten me as to what his explanation is?

 

Sticking needles in a bad back ‘eases pain better than drugs’

But so does fake acupuncture, where the needles are inserted shallowly and in the wrong places. In a trial of more than 1,100 people, both were almost twice as effective as a combination of drugs, physiotherapy and exercise.

 

The results suggest that both acupuncture and sham acupuncture act as powerful versions of the placebo effect, providing relief from symptoms as a result of the convictions that they engender in patients.

Please read the full article, linked above.

I’m not carping, I’m just telling you what they measured. And what were the results? Firstly, 27% of the medical treatment group improved: this is an impressive testament to the well known healing power of simply “being in a trialâ€, since medical treatment hadn’t helped these patients for the preceding 8 years. Meanwhile 47% of the acupuncture group improved, but the sting is this: 44% of the fake acupuncture group improved too. There was no statistically significant difference between proper, genuine ancient wisdom acupuncture, and fake, “bung a needle in, anywhere you fancy, with a bit of theatrical ceremony†acupuncture.

Again, please read the full article.

 

But there's likely no point in describing them here, as i fear you've made your mind up posieden.

Please don't fear that I've made up my mind, there is nothing to fear, after many, many hours of reading and research I have come to a conclusion regarding "alternative" therapies, can you say the same? I could be wrong of course, but at least it's my decision based on the evidence I have looked at.

Your very first sentence is just another "argument from authority" Read some peer reviewed and published papers on the subject, then make up your own mind, that's all I'm asking.

[MJ]

You'd rather believe things you read than experiance them yourself? Your no one of these shetlanders who been sooth once before, didn't like it and not going again, are you? Like I tried to say before a lot of what you say sounds like it's coming from fear of something you don't understand.

[Njugle]

No, poseidon, that's not the explanation, nor is the placebo one. The sham one tends in the right direction, but in the wrong context.

 

Have you ever tried Tai chi chuan poseidon?

 

I used to think it was all mystical and qi related. Then i tried it with our local instructor who pointed out at the first meeting that it was a form of gentle exercise and nothing more. Subsequent research showed me it is actually a form of self defence, once fully mastered. Not necessarily 'mystical'. The concept of qi doesn't always rely on any belief of anything 'supernatural'. As with many other similar subjects the proof is in the pudding. Tell people it's qi or ET or whatever you want, the actual process might just have some physical and mental benefit outwith any belief system.

 

Acupuncture is a similar situation. I haven't read the reams that you purport to, i've discussed it with medical professionals on a scientific basis and tried it myself. I know people for whom it hasn't worked at all. I know people who found the effects so profound and disconcerting that they refused further treatment. When i've had it done i haven't believed in any mystical energy, i've partially understood the body's chemical defence mechanisms and accepted an attempt to trigger them. Without any theatrical ceremony, i can assure you, quite the opposite!

[Guest posiedon]

Have you ever tried Tai chi chuan poseidon?

Nope! can't say I have

 

I used to think it was all mystical and qi related. Then i tried it with our local instructor who pointed out at the first meeting that it was a form of gentle exercise and nothing more. Subsequent research showed me it is actually a form of self defence,

I have no problem with that, but what's it got to do with homeopathy?

 

 

Acupuncture is a similar situation. I haven't read the reams that you purport to,

Now now, that's a bit provocative, I've read quite a lot, "reams" is your word not mine.

 

i've discussed it with medical professionals on a scientific basis

The peer revued papers I've read (freely available on line) are also written by medical professionals and scientists.

 

When i've had it done i haven't believed in any mystical energy, i've partially understood the body's chemical defence mechanisms and accepted an attempt to trigger them. Without any theatrical ceremony, i can assure you, quite the opposite!

That's fine, if it works for you I'm pleased for you.

Now! This discussion was supposed to be about homeopathy, and we seem to have gone off topic, I think some of the things MJ mentioned in the other thread, are to do with herbal remedies, and I have absolutely no problem with herbal remedies, but they aren't homeopathy, biodynamics, while similar to homeopathy, isn't homeopathy, Acupuncture isn't homeopathy, meditation or other relaxation techniques are not homeopathy.

If anybody wants to talk about homeopathy, fine, but do try to stay on topic Thanks.

[Guest posiedon]

Sorry MJ I missed this post before I did the one above.

You'd rather believe things you read than experiance them yourself?

Not sure what you mean by that? If I'm ill I go to a doctor, I have no reason or desire to "experience" homeopathy (if thats what we're still talking about?) I'm getting lost among all the other "alternative" therapies that are being brought up.

 

Your no one of these shetlanders who been sooth once before, didn't like it and not going again, are you?

You don't know just how wrong you are with that statement.

Like I tried to say before a lot of what you say sounds like it's coming from fear of something you don't understand.

That's a bit disingenuous of you, are you saying that after reading about something (homeopathy) that I still don't understand it?

As I've said in the post above, if you want to talk about homeopathy, fire away, but stick to homeopathy.............Please.

[Para Handy]

I would have gone to a witch doctor if it even gave me just 10 minutes pain relief. after smashing up my back at work so don't knock it until you have tried it

[Njugle]

Terribly sorry poseidon old chap, maybe i have challenged your prejudices, the thread is entitled complementary therapies which by definition includes everything from acupuncture to hopi ear candles with a little dose of chiropractice and massage therapies along the way, god help me it even includes aromatherapy, yeegads! However, if you don't want to talk about it then please allow others to. It is you that is indeed attempting to go off topic.

 

Oh and the Tai chi chuan was illustrative, i make no apologies, it was relevant.

[Guest posiedon]

Njugle"]Terribly sorry poseidon old chapI seem to have challenged your prejudices,

,I'm not your "old chap" and I don't have any "prejudices" thank you. And please stop being so bloody patronising.

the thread is entitled complementary therapies which by definition includes everything from acupuncture to hopi ear candles with a little dose of chiropractice and massage therapies along the way, god help me it even includes aromatherapy, yeegads! However, if you don't want to talk about it then please allow others to. It is you that is indeed attempting to go off topic.

I was speaking to Mj about homeopathy, not other alternative therapies, but "homoeopathy"

You have jumped in and completely changed the debate.

On some other boards I post on you would be banned for de-railing a discussion.

If you want to discuss homeopathy, then by all means join in, but if you're just going to introduce different aspects of "alternative therapies" then please start a new thread.

 

I want to talk about HOMEOPATHY! if you want to talk about something else, Acupuncture, or relaxation, start another thread. I joined this discussion to talk about homeopathy,

MJ, Do you want to talk about homeopathy?

Sorry bout the rant, (it's the wine ya know) but I stick by what I say, if anybody wants a debate about homeopathy bring it on, but as I've already said, stick to the subject.

End of rant, bedtime

[Guest Pronto]

There is a zero balancer in shetland.

[Mag]

There is already a discussion thread specifically about homeopathy, in the Consumer Advise Form, 'Homeopathic NHS GP in Shetland.' Posidon, is that maybe the thread you want for a homeopathic-specific discussion rather than this one about alternative therapies?

[Njugle]

^

Yes indeed. As Mag says:

http://www.shetlink.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4284

 

Just to prevent any repeat discussions. (Not good forum practice)

 

(and for the record there was only one post separating the subject of acupuncture by MJ and my post, hardly a wild deviation, i'd have thought)

 

What caught my eye was the part about men having vasectomies using acupuncture which is a terrifying thought but i can see how acupuncture could release a pre-emptive dose of endorphins which would have a beneficial analgesic effect. Some people react very strongly to acupuncture and for these it would be a workable solution. For those whose physiology doesn't react strongly, well...ouch!

 

Following through on another subject mention within this page, zero balancing, human beings are hard-wired from infancy to thrive through touch. Any prolonged period of relaxation involving non-invasive touch is almost guaranteed to be therapeutic to some extent, whether you believe in any of the energy concepts associated with it. (Although to some extent there is a scientific background to that too, in that focused awareness on any body part can induce heightened electrical activity from the nervous system there and 'energy' as such)

[khitajrah]

A few years ago I took the first level of Zero Balancing training and thoroughly enjoyed it. Although I would have preferred to have learned more about any scientific basis of the therapy I enjoyed the physical contact (I was told I have a very hungry donkey*) the relaxation and the company of my fellow students. I have never even once practised what I learned during the 5 days of training, but apparently, according to the instructor, I was very good at it.

 

* Donkeys are sociable creatures and require the company and physical contact of other donkeys to be content. Zero Balancers believe that we all have "inner donkeys" that require the same physical contact to maintain health and happiness. (or something of that like anyway)