Mareel - Cinema & Music Venue

[Guest Anonymous]

Mind you, and not meaning to sound like an alarmist loony, but I do think that with rising sea levels, if it's going to be built at the North Ness, we'll end up sitting through performances in wir rubber boots, snorkels at hand. Is there an alternative site?

 

Top o Ronas Hill Peter......only joking!!! Not at the moment but this is an issue for the architects to look at when and if the time comes.

[Guest Anonymous]

I have children and I hope they will want to live here when they grow up, but, honestly, an arts venue is not going to be one of the factors they will be considering when making that decision.

 

The complaint that there is nothing for them to do, and nowhere for them to go, is something that young people have been stating, time and time again, over the decades. Music, and the arts in general, is something which young people become passionately involved in. It is a fantastic way for youngsters to develop socially, getting them participating in group activities, travelling abroad... there are so many opportunities. I think this project can only encourage this further.

 

I do believe that business plans have to be taken from a very pessimistic perspective, to err on the safe side, and if that is the approach that they are usually reasonably realistic - if you take a worst-case scenario it is most likely to turn out that way! However, personally, I think that £80K per year is an investment with returns which are, although difficult to put a "price" on, worthwhile. Public money has always been contributed into projects which appeal to very narrow groups of people, with specialised interests (think of any club who've had premises built for them, and need ongoing subsidy), and although funded by the many for the benefit of the few, this is a principle which has always been accepted, and rarely resented by the wider community. Music and the arts in general unarguably appeal to a vast range of the population, compared to most specialist interests, so I personally think that it is worthy of such funding.

 

No-one wants a "white elephant", or anything which is going to whittle away our childrens' nest-egg, but, taking even the most pessimistic figures, I believe that it is a figure worth spending, in consideration of the likely benefits.

 

And as Marvin has pointed out, not a penny of it comes out of our council tax, so what are we all arguing about anyway?

 

I sat "on the fence" about this venue for a while. Many years ago I thought it was exactly what Shetland needed, and it didn't happen. Then I thought, "hm, downloads, home cinema, the garrison's doing a good job, maybe Clickimin is all we need", but having read the full debate on this forum, which has been most informative, I am now persuaded that it is very much a good thing, and I give it my full support.

 

I understand the concerns of local businesses, and if there is a threat to them then it is vital to avoid damaging livelihoods, but personally I think that, as this venue will be built in Lerwick rather than "out in the sticks", that it will only attract more business to town pubs rather than less, with pre and post "gig" drinking likely (this has proven to be the case at similar projects elsewhere). Hopefully the "outreach" element will help stimulate good nights out in the wilds too, where the real fun is had anyway

 

Thanks for that Peter - well put, but then I'm biased

[Guest Anonymous]

welli have it that it was booked a month before and thought of the month b4 that - so i think your wrong!

 

Not sure of your point here but as I say I'm not a cinema expert. However here's a couple of personal observations.

 

Breakback Mountain was showing in Glasgow when I was there in mid-Jan and it only came here last week.

 

I saw Walk the Line about 6 weeks ago on the mainland - then I saw it again on a plane while I was travelling about a month back.......its only here next time around. Good enough for me though as I will see it again then.....great film!!!!

 

And sadly we dont even get all the top films here. I have been waiting to see Wolf Creek, a fairly high profile film, which was also showing in Glasgow in Jan, but to the best of my knowledge it's not been here yet

 

Dont get me wrong Film Mobile Scotland and the Garrison do a great job under the circumstances but you can only do so much and show so many films on a once-a-monthy cycle.

 

Sometimes we get the films early sometimes I suspect its about par for the course with other local cinemas - which is still pretty acceptable for those of us that dont have the option of seeing the film any other way - until the DVD comes out of course.

 

Somebody highlighted the improving quality of pirate DVD's in an earlier comment. I seriously hope we never see those as a serious competitor (as they seemed to imply they might become) or a valid reason for not having an official entertainment facility in Shetland. Shame on them for that!!!! If that were the case there would be no industry left to debate anyway.

 

Sure Harry Potter was an amazing coup but "one swallow don't make a summer" as they say.

 

i think you will find that all the harry potter films have been here on time (or near it) unlike the other smaler cinemas whare its months behind us. If you look at the other wee cinemas they are a lot worse that Shetland - which is the future - my point is if you think its bad now - just waite and see how bad it will be in the new place when they have to waite untill the big places are finished with them.

 

pluss when the odd turkey somes along we will be forsed to keep it for a week.

 

The film on the one of your many flights are from America which dont count as the us dates and the uk dates are sometimes months apart.

 

I have been on long hall flights and i bet the good film was on the way from the USA and not the one from the uk as well.

 

Somtimes you can get USA DVDs before they are even in the UK cinemas

[Guest Anonymous]

Mind you, and not meaning to sound like an alarmist loony, but I do think that with rising sea levels, if it's going to be built at the North Ness, we'll end up sitting through performances in wir rubber boots, snorkels at hand. Is there an alternative site?

 

thats a good point!

 

i remember that the ice factory was refused planing permition because it was near the sea? so how has the new place been alowed to continue right on the edge?

[Marvin]

 

i remember that the ice factory was refused planing permition because it was near the sea? so how has the new place been alowed to continue right on the edge?

 

I've not been involved with planning issues but the ice factory was planned many years ago. Planning regs and Planning policies have changed many times since then..

[madcow]

I don't know where people get the idea that more people will use local pubs before and after an event. It doesn't happen at the moment. There is no sudden surge in pub numbers when a gig finishes or a concert ends. Why do you think it will be any different if the new venue is built?

 

Also, to answer Davie G's point, it was arranged to show "Brokeback Mountain" (not "Breakback") in February. If you had attended any of the films in February (9th-12) you would have seen it being advertised on the screen before they started.

 

The Oscars were on 5th March.

[dB]

Making £1400 on a Saturday in a pub where all they sell is drinks is not an argument.

 

Try a cafe bar or whatever in a venue where the entertainment is meant to be the main feature on a Monday or Tuesday - I really don't think £1400 is achievable.

 

I'm not arguing that the pubs can't make this type of money, I am arguing that a cafe bar or whatever you want to call it, where it is not the main attraction, will be struggling to make this amount day in day out. And they would have to be earning this amount every day to acheive the figures quoted.

 

 

 

Hows about this for a scenario

 

Monday - Film - 50 people - everybody spends £5 on food/drink - £250

Tuesday - Film and small music event - 150 people - average spend £5 - £750

Wednesday - Film - 100 people - average spend £5 - £500

Thusday - Film and a gig 150 people- average spend £8 - £1200

Friday - Film and a gig - 700 people - average spend £12 - £8,400

Saturday - Film and a gig - 700 peolpe - average spend £12 - £8,400

Sunday - Film and small gig - 100 people - average spend £5 - 500

 

Total income through food/drink - £20,000 which equals out at £2,857 per day. If you add on to that cafe takings through the day from passing trade (its going to be closest cafe to where I work) I don't think it is unreasonable to expect an average of £1400 to come in. The argument is how much of that is displacement from existing businesses and how much of it is 'new' trade.

 

 

Marvin - how about this for real life. There was a musical event at the Garrison last night, approx 240 attended (not a sell-out) even though it's supposed to be a very popular show. The food / juice / water sales totalled £29.95 which doesn't quite reach the heady heights of 13 pence per person spend.

 

Yet you're blithely quoting at least a fiver per person spend in the new CMV based on WHAT?

 

Why don't you contact Islesburgh for the real figures regarding entertainment trends in Shetland.

 

Get back to me when you've had a big mug of reality.

[Guest Anonymous]

People in Shetland are earning less. So where is all this money going to come from?

 

Its about time you lot got real.

 

Who wrote this business plan The man from Del Monte?....No Maybe Robert Maxwell ![/i]

[Marvin]

 

Who wrote this business plan The man from Del Monte?....No Maybe Robert Maxwell ![/i]

 

Ha, Ha......touché!

 

Marvin - how about this for real life. There was a musical event at the Garrison last night, approx 240 attended (not a sell-out) even though it's supposed to be a very popular show. The food / juice / water sales totalled £29.95 which doesn't quite reach the heady heights of 13 pence per person spend.

 

Yet you're blithely quoting at least a fiver per person spend in the new CMV based on WHAT?

 

 

What I said was consider this as a scenario. What I was trying to point out was that £1400 is not an absurd value.

 

The Garrison sell sweeties and cartons of juice and is restricted by space. I don’t think you can compare a cafe, bar and shop (presumably some sort of hotdog vendor) with a table set up in a foyer and expect the same level of spend. I based my ‘very rough’ figures on what I do know about sales in bars. I have worked in most of Lerwick’s pubs and I used to run Klub Revolution at the Country Club premises. On one very good night we cleared well over £2000 across the bar and we were only open for 3 hours and the price of the drink was much lower than the pubs and the max capacity was 120.

 

If I was going to the pictures and taking the bairns I would easily expect to purchase a fivers worth of brucky sweeties and juice beforehand followed by at least a fivers worth of hot dogs after.

 

I didn’t claim anywhere that these figures were scientifically composed – only a scenario to consider. £1400 might seem like a lot of cash but in reality it is not a lot. Anyway, turnover of £1400 per day doesn’t really mean a lot if there are no outgoings or profit figures to compare it with…..I think we may be arguing over nothing

 

And also....please note, I'm not 'pro venue'. I'm very much 'on the fence'. All I want to do is explore the facts and keep the debate going in a balanced and fair manner.

 

Cheers

 

Marvin

[dB]

 

Who wrote this business plan The man from Del Monte?....No Maybe Robert Maxwell ![/i]

 

Ha, Ha......touché!

 

Marvin - how about this for real life. There was a musical event at the Garrison last night, approx 240 attended (not a sell-out) even though it's supposed to be a very popular show. The food / juice / water sales totalled £29.95 which doesn't quite reach the heady heights of 13 pence per person spend.

 

Yet you're blithely quoting at least a fiver per person spend in the new CMV based on WHAT?

 

 

What I said was consider this as a scenario. What I was trying to point out was that £1400 is not an absurd value.

 

The Garrison sell sweeties and cartons of juice and is restricted by space. I don’t think you can compare a cafe, bar and shop (presumably some sort of hotdog vendor) with a table set up in a foyer and expect the same level of spend. I based my ‘very rough’ figures on what I do know about sales in bars. I have worked in most of Lerwick’s pubs and I used to run Klub Revolution at the Country Club premises. On one very good night we cleared well over £2000 across the bar and we were only open for 3 hours and the price of the drink was much lower than the pubs and the max capacity was 120.

 

If I was going to the pictures and taking the bairns I would easily expect to purchase a fivers worth of brucky sweeties and juice beforehand followed by at least a fivers worth of hot dogs after.

 

I didn’t claim anywhere that these figures were scientifically composed – only a scenario to consider. £1400 might seem like a lot of cash but in reality it is not a lot. Anyway, turnover of £1400 per day doesn’t really mean a lot if there are no outgoings or profit figures to compare it with…..I think we may be arguing over nothing

 

And also....please note, I'm not 'pro venue'. I'm very much 'on the fence'. All I want to do is explore the facts and keep the debate going in a balanced and fair manner.

 

Cheers

 

Marvin

 

 

 

 

Going by your last quote you say you would spend a fiver going into and another fiver coming out of the cinema with the bairns. Sorry but you're seriously underspending going by your "scenario".

 

Assuming two parents and two bairns you would need to spend at least £20.00 to match your lowest scenario figure of a fiver a head. Add the price to get in of £17.00 (at Garrison figures for 2 adults and 2 bairns) and you're nearly at £40.00 assuming you can walk to the venue.

 

The point I'm trying to make is that for any entertainment business to average £1400 per day, EVERY day you need a much bigger population.

I still maintain that the figures are seriously flawed and we shouldn't be spending money we can ill afford on a venture based on a thoroughly unrealistic business plan.

 

Can we have some input from the local entertainment industry? Is £1400 per day for 360 days realistically achievable? Am I talking rubbish? Show me some true figures from REAL businesses operating locally and I'll revise my opinion if I'm proved wrong.

 

Please don't get me started on the projected customer levels - they are another way-out guesstimate which is not based on what really happens locally.

 

I too am not totally anti-venue. I don't believe the figures in the business plan are achievable and I firmly believe that our elected councillors should only be voting to spend our money on realistic figures.

[Ally]

what are we talking about?

[Marvin]

what are we talking about?

 

Ha, Ha........

[Marvin]

 

Going by your last quote you say you would spend a fiver going into and another fiver coming out of the cinema with the bairns. Sorry but you're seriously underspending going by your "scenario".

 

.

 

But I'm perhaps also underestimating my viewing figures if 240 turned out last night for a film....Its all about guesswork. As I said it was only a scenario.

 

Cheers

 

Marvin

[dB]

 

Going by your last quote you say you would spend a fiver going into and another fiver coming out of the cinema with the bairns. Sorry but you're seriously underspending going by your "scenario".

 

.

 

But I'm perhaps also underestimating my viewing figures if 240 turned out last night for a film....Its all about guesswork. As I said it was only a scenario.

 

Cheers

 

Marvin

 

 

 

 

Perhaps you should re-read my earlier post. Last night WASN'T a film, it was probably the most popular concert of the year at the Garrison. Last year it sold out two nights, this year it's on three nights and HASN'T sold out.

 

How about the new Jim Carey film that was on at the Garrison last Thursday? Attendance 8.

 

Do you see where I'm coming from regarding these figures. Don't take my word for it - ask Islesburgh.

[JustMe]

Cinema brings 60 jobs to Spa town

An 11-screen cinema complex opens at the site of a new shopping and leisure development in Cheltenham on Friday, bringing 60 jobs to the town.

 

Cineworld is part of the multi-million pound Brewery Centre, which has been under construction for two years.

 

The centre occupies the site of the former Whitbread Brewery between Henrietta Street and Bennington Street.

 

Three restaurants and a multi-storey car park are already open and the rest of the development opens next month.

 

This from the BBC today. Cheltenham not being that big a town and having lots of cities reasonably close by yet the developers opting for an 11 screen multiplex makes me wonder if perhaps the cinema side of our new venue should have more screens so that there are more films shown every night to tempt us from the tv.....just a thought.