Drummers!!

[djb]

Hey needing a hand, was wondering what drum kits everyone had and any reccomendations on what i should go for thinking on spending around a grand, cheers

[Fjool]

To be honest, if I had a grand to spend on a kit, I would be seriously considering getting a pukka electric set. Very flexible, lots of options in sound and placement. Robust and low-maintennance. Plus, you can play through headphones or DI into a mixer; much easier than miking everything up.

 

On the downside, of course, is that they don't play quite the same; don't look so nice.

[djb]

do you play?

if so what?

[AndyVocoustic]

i would invest it in a savings bond.

....because unlike drummers they eventually mature and make money!

 

[Fjool]

^^

 

@djb: I play a little bit but do not have the space for a full kit, so I make do with a nice, steel-bodied snare; a hi-hat (stand was new, hats were £10 from eBay), augmented by a Yamaha drum-machine with foot pedals to provide the kick drum.

 

It's not a pro' set up, but it does for a bit of practice.

[Jono]

I play a Premier Artists Birch, was a recommendation from Russell Gair. Last time i spoke to him he was talking about selling a few of his old kits, go along Shetland Drums and talk to him or Murray.

[Jono]

I'd love an Orange County kit though.

 

ocdrum.com

[Marooned in Maywick]

Something along the lines of...this...should keep you going.

Might be a coupla quid more than a grand, though.

[tirvaluk]

Imagine setting yun lot up in Flints, half da punters would have to stay outside

[McFly]

On the downside, of course, is that they don't play quite the same; don't look so nice.

 

.......and don't sound anything like the real thing!

 

I would happily gig with an electronic kit, purely for the convenience, but I would never record one as a substitute for a good acoustic kit. Current technology just isn't capable of reproducing the subtlety and nuance of a quality, well tuned and well played acoustic drum.

 

I play a Pearl BRX Masters Studio, and would highly recommend them.

 

Is the grand for drums, cymbals and hardware, or just the drums?

[Fjool]

.......and don't sound anything like the real thing!

 

A complaint which I'm sure was levelled at the bass guitar when fender first brought it to market.

 

I think it might very much depends on the quality of the kits in question. Have heard some shoddy sounding practice kits, and am aware of some very high-end digital kits that sound pretty damn sharp - but haven't heard with my own ears; a bit like watching an advert for a hi-def television on your old television. :S

 

I agree that there's a lot to a traditional kit which the talented drummer would miss in a digital kit but I think it's in the mechanism, not necessarily the sound reproduction any more. We've had a similar debate previously, McFly and, if I remember correctly, you were supporting the notion that digital audio can be every bit as good as analogue. Of course, there are also kinetic issues this time - the physical drum kit's response - but great strides have been made toward replicating the authentic drum feel, combined with the benefits of digital.

 

For a barely-a-drummer such as myself, the ability to use the digital kit as a midi trigger, for regrooving and correcting rhythms is a big benefit.

[Gandhi]

I have a Mapex M Series 5 piece kit with a fine assortment of Sabian cymbals which lives in soft cases in my loft while downstairs in the spare room I lovingly pound a Pintech mesh head electronic kit with a Roland TD8 module. The mesh heads feel great and the roland module (witha bit of tweaking) sounds brilliant. If anything lets it down it is the feel of the hi hat and cymbals (my hi hat is home made using a Billy Hyde practice pad into which I inserted 3 piezo transducers) The cymbals are of the cheaper type but Rolands new 2 piece hi hat is wonderfully responsive if youve got the cash and Hart Dynamics make brilliant electronic cymbals (their Ride is cast bronze, feels just like he real thing). If you are recording in a home environment, within the context of a mix the Roland module will win hands down against an imperfectly tuned/rattly kit, an accoustically less than ideal room, an inexperienced engineer, lack of decent mikes or a combination of these factors. But most importantly, the electronic kit really encourages you to play and practice because it sounds so great, its easy to play along with cds on headphones, there is a metronome and backing tracks easily at hand and you don't have to worry about neighbours/family/time of day.

[McFly]

but I think it's in the mechanism, not necessarily the sound reproduction any more

 

You're absolutely right, my dear boy, and that's exactly what I was getting at.

 

I'm not making any sort of point about the quality of digitally sampled noises, but that's what electronic drum kits produce: samples (ie. recordings) of other people playing drums. And there's only so much the player can do with those recordings.

 

Your average trigger on an electronic kit might be capable of producing 20 or 30 different output states (depending on where you hit it and how hard) which equates directly to 20 or 30 different noises. A skilled drummer playing a good kit has, literally, an infinite number of noises and tones at his disposal.

 

Now that's quite a difference

[Fjool]

A skilled drummer playing a good kit has, literally, an infinite number of noises and tones at his disposal.

 

Now that's quite a difference

 

Well... yes and no. A digital kit has the advantage of being able to switch from one snare to another by pressing a button. The range and application of the sounds is limited less by the hardware and more by the software which processes the samples.

 

My very basic drum pads here cover the 128 levels (volume) of midi signal, but do not care where I strike the pad. Your more sophisticated kit measuring at '20 or 30' points doesn't have to choose a particular sample... they can be interpolated and mixed on the fly, de-tuned, processed, and so on. Striking the pad in one place can trigger a convincing mix of several co-processed samples based on the inputs from far fewer than 30 points.

 

No, my point is that things like the bounce off the skin, the zing of a cymbal, the softer response of the floor-tom... these physical properties are still difficult to incorporate into a digital kit.

 

Apart from this a good digital kit will keep a good drummer quite happy these days.

[McFly]

My very basic drum pads here cover the 128 levels (volume) of midi signal, but do not care where I strike the pad. Your more sophisticated kit measuring at '20 or 30' points doesn't have to choose a particular sample... they can be interpolated and mixed on the fly, de-tuned, processed, and so on.

 

Uh huh.

 

Still less than infinite, so my point stands.