The Rangers & Celtic thread.

[dB]

Sectarianism isn't necessarily racist, its "bigotry, discrimination, prejudice or hatred" against religion, right?

 

The Famine song, regularly chanted by thousands of Rangers supporters, despite being warned by the Ibrox hierarchy that they face arrest for doing so, has been deemed racist.

 

Embracing racism and paedophilia the Famine song far outranks anything sung by Celtic supporters in terms of bile, odiousness and sheer bad taste.

 

The silence from the politicians, police, SFA, SPL and Rangers themselves on this issue shames the whole of Scotland.

[Pooks]

Both sides seem to be guilty as far as I can tell. Instead of bickering about it why not put your heads together for a way to stop it?

 

I have yet to see a situation where both sets of supporters sing in harmony to drown out any racist/discriminating/prejudiced chants. Perhaps if it did happen, then less of the playground songs would take place.

[dB]

Spot on JAS!

 

db, there are many cases of Celtic fans singing sectarian chants, and if you think that is not true, then my friend you are part of the problem, not the solution.

 

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/scotland/article3638867.ece

 

I have been at games and have witnessed neds singing these pathetic songs, only to get booed by the rest of us.

 

Also, I don't suscribe to this "national conspiracy" in which all the media is against Celtic, is a load of balls, each team has their critics, its swings and roundabouts.

 

As for "take yer time", no really sure what you meant by that? Perhaps you could explain?

 

Cheers.

 

 

 

I hardly know where to start with this.

 

If you're the big Celtic fan you're trying to portray yourself as you'll be aware that the UEFA investigation was instigated by UEFA following a complaint from an "unbiased" Scottish reporter.

 

You'll also be aware that it was dropped by UEFA after a couple of days, basically because it was a load of crap.

 

http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/football/Uefa-drops-sectarian-probe-into.3932545.jp

 

I find it very strange that you should choose this non-story to back up your claims of rampant sectarianism by Celtic fans. Do you even know what sectarianism is..??

 

FYI, I was at that match in Barcelona. There was no sectarian chanting inside the ground. In fact, the people of Barcelona welcomed us with open arms. They're well aware of the differences between the two sets of supporters. As are the people of Villareal and Manchester.

 

Strange that a Shetland-based "Celtic" supporter feels the need to argue differently.

 

Even more strange that this Shetland-based "Celtic" supporter believes that the Scottish media are unbiased in their reporting of issues concerning Celtic.

 

How often have Celtic successfully sued the Scottish newspapers...??

 

As a "Celtic" fan I'm sure you'll have the answer at your fingertips.

 

"Take your time..??" Simple really, I'm still waiting for your response re TFS. No hurry.

[dB]

Both sides seem to be guilty as far as I can tell. Instead of bickering about it why not put your heads together for a way to stop it?

 

I have yet to see a situation where both sets of supporters sing in harmony to drown out any racist/discriminating/prejudiced chants. Perhaps if it did happen, then less of the playground songs would take place.

 

 

Guilty of what..??

[Medziotojas]

Jeez, this old firm debate; it's a little like shouting at the mirror.

[Pooks]

Guilty of songs/chants/whatever you want to call it, that can incite violence and hatred.

[dB]

Guilty of songs/chants/whatever you want to call it, that can incite violence and hatred.

 

 

No sh*t, Sherlock...????

 

Every club in the world (with a support) is guilty of this.

 

The ones who do the racist stuff are quite rightly roundly condemned for it.

 

Except in Scotland.

[Pooks]

I think you have missed the gist of my post. As Medziotojas has kindly pointed out, this debate seems to get nowhere. It goes around and around in circles until everybody blames each other. Then it starts again.

 

The fact that none of it has very much to do with football doesn't seem to click with the football 'supporters'.

 

We could make all the pitches into skate parks instead.

[dB]

I think you have missed the gist of my post.

Don't think so. My interpretation of your post is that you can't be bothered to actually debate it and settle for the "two sides of the same coin" view. This isn't a criticism of you BTW.

 

I have never denied that Celtic, like all clubs, have their share of halfwits.

 

However, every Celtic fan I know (apart from that poster earlier) is desperate to drop the Old Firm tag, drop the joint sponsorship deals and distance ourselves from Rangers.

 

Celtic fans do NOT subscribe to the "two sides of the same coin" theory.

 

I can understand how supporters of other clubs find the whole thing tedious but no one's forced to read these threads.

[JAStewart]

For everyone's benefit, here's the Famine Song, with the 'bad' bit highlighted (as far as the press have noted)

 

I often wonder where they would have been

If we hadn't have taken them in

Fed them and washed them

Thousands in Glasgow alone

From Ireland they came

Brought us nothing but trouble and shame

Well the famine is over

Why don't they go home?

 

Now Athenry Mike was a thief

And Large John he was fully briefed

And that wee traitor from Castlemilk

Turned his back on his own

They've all their Papists in Rome

They have U2 and Bono

Well the famine is over

Why don't they go home?

 

INSTRUMENTAL

 

Now they raped and fondled their kids

That's what those perverts from the darkside did

And they swept it under the carpet

and Large John he hid

Their evils seeds have been sown

Cause they're not of our own

Well the famine is over

Why don't you go home?

 

Now Timmy don't take it from me

Cause if you know your history

You've persecuted thousands of people

In Ireland alone

You turned on the lights

Fuelled U boats by night

That's how you repay us

It's time to go home.

[nederlander]

I'm sorry, but are you having difficulty understanding that there are Shetland based Celtic fans?

Ok, so as far as I can see, you think I am not a Celtic fan (Ifigured this out due to your wonderful overuse of the old "..." tactic, superb stuff by the way) because I understand that there are sections of the Celtic support are guilty of sectarian chants. Again, if you do not accepet that then more fool you, the thing is I think you do realise that. As such, I am not so much arguing differently as I am trying to point out that there is a minority of Celtic fans that are as bad as the minority of Rangers fans. That said, I would agree that the songs sung by Rangers fans are of a particularly nasty nature, a prime example being BJK.

 

RE. your point about dropping the Old Firm tag. Not sure if you were referring to me, but....... I would not like to see that happen, neither would any Celtic fan I have spoken to, not to say there aren't some who would. Whether you like it or not, Rangers are part of Celtics history, and as such are part of what makes Celtic great! The rivalry (and friendly banter between the friendly fans) is second to none!

[JAStewart]

Its entertaining to this Arab that "Old Firm" refers to the first OF game, where the supporters got on so well, it was as if they were "Old firm friends". Now look at it.

[dB]

I'm sorry, but are you having difficulty understanding that there are Shetland based Celtic fans?

I'm having difficulty understanding what the point of this question is.

 

 

Ok, so as far as I can see, you think I am not a Celtic fan (Ifigured this out due to your wonderful overuse of the old "..." tactic, superb stuff by the way)

Your opinions mirror those found on Follow Follow. What else should I think..??

 

 

because I understand that there are sections of the Celtic support are guilty of sectarian chants.

Can you name some of these sectarian chants..??

 

 

Again, if you do not accepet that then more fool you, the thing is I think you do realise that. As such, I am not so much arguing differently as I am trying to point out that there is a minority of Celtic fans that are as bad as the minority of Rangers fans.

Rubbish. You're trying to tell me a few Celtic fans at an away fixture singing Boys of the Old Brigade equates to a packed Ibrox belting out the Famine song, the successor to the Billy Boys...?? Do me a favour.

I've never denied that Celtic have a few fans who let us down. Every club in the world has this. My argument is that Rangers have a far bigger and much more nasty problem, which they do next to nothing to resolve. You in fact confirm this later in your post.

 

That said, I would agree that the songs sung by Rangers fans are of a particularly nasty nature, a prime example being BJK.

See above. BTW they're more than "particularly nasty", they're illegal.

 

RE. your point about dropping the Old Firm tag. Not sure if you were referring to me, but....... I would not like to see that happen, neither would any Celtic fan I have spoken to, not to say there aren't some who would. Whether you like it or not, Rangers are part of Celtics history, and as such are part of what makes Celtic great! The rivalry (and friendly banter between the friendly fans) is second to none!

You keep believing we're two sides of the same coin. You're obviously happy to be tarred with the same brush.

 

I'm not.

[nederlander]

[Can you name some of these sectarian chants..??/quote]

 

Any song referencing the IRA, of which there are many. At away games "go home ya huns" are sung to Rangers, Hearts and Kilmarnock fans. This is of course a minority, but still a massive problem.

 

Quite frankly I couldn't give a toss if you doubt whether or not I am a Celtic fan, I know, as do many others, who i support, your opinion is yours and yours alone.

 

Answer me this, do you have any Rangers supporting mates?

[Marooned in Maywick]

Its entertaining to this Arab that "Old Firm" refers to the first OF game, where the supporters got on so well, it was as if they were "Old firm friends". Now look at it.

 

My understanding of the terminology was something similar to the next bit on that Wikipedia reference...'William J. Murray states that the term derives from the commercial benefits of the two clubs' rivalry, which were viewed with distaste in some quarters in the early days of the game.'

 

Whilst dB states that many Celtic supporters of his acquaintance would like to end the so-called links, it would appear that those in the respective boardrooms don't share that view.

 

How else could one explain, just to highlight a recent example, the Old Firm's demands for that 5% levy on handling ticket sales? Sheer coincidence that both clubs should announce it?

 

Whether the fans like it or not they (the clubs) are in it (a tacit agreement) together for their mutual benefit.