CCTV

[sheepshagger]

having lived in cities with CCTV I cant understand the objections on here.

I never felt like my privacy was being invaded.

It made areas a lot safer, the taxi ranks were covered so it allowed folk to get from the club/pub and into to a taxi safer than had been the case before. Assaults at taxi ranks were common place and dropped dramatically when the cameras were installed. It wont stop everyone but it will ensure evidence that can be used in court, and with the ability to go back through the tapes a good chance of identifying those responsible in the first place.

Folk that only intend to enjoy themselves without committing a crime will not let a camera keep them away from the street and if it prevents the random assaults etc it will surely encourage them to frequent the town centre more often.

And once all the Ned's have been locked up we can get rid of that ridiculous law preventing us from having a beer outside when we do visit the town

[Ghostrider]

^^ In a bigger town/city with the anonymity which that affords, invasion of privacy would be a lesser, or non-issue. Unfortunately in a place the size of Shetland, and especially in a peerier place like Lerrik, where everybody is a kent face, what those with access to the Monitors/tapes "could" make use of and/or benefit from what is thereon, IMHO, cancels out the possible benefits.

 

I can't say I entirely trust the Police we've got to "use" whatever may be on a tape as responsibily as should be expected, and unless the selection of "volunteers" to man the system is especially searching and stringent, you just know the kind of people who will be on the job. The smallest indiscretion, or what appears to them as an indiscretion from their point of view, will be all round the toon via the jungle drums long before dawn.

[sheepshagger]

What kind of indiscretion are you worried about. If you do nothing you are ashamed of doing then why worry who sees what you do.

In a small place like Shetland most indiscretions are local gossip anyway without the cameras so no change there.

But as stated in my previous post it does seem to work when it comes to cutting down the crime in the areas covered

[abraxas]

Exactimondo, Mr S! As fer not trustin' cops with confidential information, Holey Moses on a unicycle, I hate te be the one te break it te yez, but I think some damn fool might have just already allowed them access to some pretty confidential stuff on a lot of folk. Don't tell them it was me as said so, though!!

 

And I could be wrong, but Data Protection an' a leetle theengy called Human Rights (Article 8 in particular) have a little summat te do with it all too.

[Styles]

Waste of cash, im going on a one man crime wave in spite to ruin their figures.

[Njugle]

Well, i'm undecided, but on the 'deteriorating state of society' angle, now they have provided a reason, which will be acted on, for the 'neds',chavs or whatever to put up their hoods, pull down their caps and probably cover their mouths, just to be cool in the face of 'oppressive society', thus encouraging the trend toward disassociation, anti-community and intimidation.

 

Bets anybody?

 

oh yeah, where is the camera viewing to be funded from, does the retailers association or whatever fund it, or is it to come from the Police budget or elsewhere?

[Ghostrider]

Exactimondo, Mr S! As fer not trustin' cops with confidential information, Holey Moses on a unicycle, I hate te be the one te break it te yez, but I think some damn fool might have just already allowed them access to some pretty confidential stuff on a lot of folk. Don't tell them it was me as said so, though!!

 

And I could be wrong, but Data Protection an' a leetle theengy called Human Rights (Article 8 in particular) have a little summat te do with it all too.

 

Something tells me that you don't live in Shetland and probably have never lived in Shetland for any appreciable period of time, as if you did/had I find it inconceivable that you wouldn't be aware of the methods which appear to be employed locally which cause me to lack full trust in them, concerning what the Police could/might use what will be on these tapes for, and it has nothing to do with anything so simple and overt as your examples.

[DamnSaxon]

Money well spent if it improves safety and stops the mindless vandalism all too evident in the street IMHO. We have wasted much more on much less.

Er, yes, but every study seems to show that CCTV makes no overall difference to crime rates - in some areas crime goes down, but in others it goes up or stays much the same. It does, however, give the police / authorities a full record of your innocent doings, if you really think that's desirable.

 

And never forget that figure of 4.5 million cameras in the UK relates to 2002. I haven't noticed any slowdown in the infestation in my local city, but I've never seen a more recent (= more worrying?) figure. Also, does the figure include the millions in pubs, clubs, shops ... ? - all of which are used by the police.

[abraxas]

Hey GR, something tells me ye're wrong, me ol' mucker! I DO live in Shetland an have done so fer about 7 years now.

 

Don't flannel me with the "if you did you would be aware of how evil they are!!!" sorta stuff. I mean I know the story about the Inspector, but how's about givin' us ignorami some examples of the heinous deeds done by yer local rozzers. if it really is the case? And why have I never seen any such examples posted by yerself or yer compatriots before now?

 

WE give the Police their power. They are public servants and - it may surprise ye - can be made te answer fer their actions. So why have yez never made anythin' o' this before now? Where have been the protest marches, the demonstrations, the .... heck, yez get the picture.

 

In my previous life (I mean before I settled here) I visited and at times lived in countries where they have little or no civil rights. JHC on a swizzle stick, even in our "civilised neighbour" countries like France, Italy and Germany, they have FAR less respect fer yer human rights than are afforded ye here.

 

Something tells me that, in yer own endearingly myopic way, yez don't know how lucky yez really are.

 

So what if there is a camera on a building? Unless yez are doing something wrong (illegal OR indiscreet) it won't bother yez. And if yez are doing something wrong, ye won't do it under the camera, will ye?

 

There is often the argument that it will "displace" trouble. I have written and reported on crime around the world for almost 22 years before coming here. It is an argument which, for the most part, loses ground after the cameras are in an' fowk get te see the benefits. No-one sez it's a feckin' magic wand as will make crime disappear overnight. It's a tool to be employed LEGALLY for LEGAL purposes. Not te snoop on what ye're buyin' from Boots fer yer "night out with the boys" .

 

Or are ye really THAT interesting that the operator would have nothin else te do except watch yez all day?!

 

Tell ye what, ask the elderly lady (I would have put her at 65+) that I helped up off Commercial Street outside the jewellers three Saturdays ago (last time I was on the street) after two teenage boys running and playing "kick the can/bottle" knocked her over and laughed. They laughed at me too when I told them to {'f' it was funny in Father Ted 'eck'} off, but at least they moved away, however briefly.

 

Nope, ye're right, it'd be just WRONG te be able te lead video evidence of crimes in court, thereby forcin' the guilty te plead earlier (can't often argue with video evidence, or if ye do ye're mostly not all there) an' not waste so much taxpayers' money on cases where they plead on the morning of trial. That's a really bad idea. Coz after all, this is Shetland an' it's perfect an' there's no crime here.

 

I know of at least three violent group assaults on the Street since I have been here, where NO-ONE came forward with evidence - despite plenty fowk being around - and NO-ONE was arrested fer them. One o' the lads who got a kicking (and stamping) is permanently disabled now, but ye're right, yer paranoia is more important.

 

I KNOW it can happen anywhere, but at least it'll make these places a good bit safer fer most fowk, an' that gets my vote (unless I'm not entitled to vote coz I'm not from here??).

[JAStewart]

Come to think of it, I don't mind CCTV. If it helps to being to justice at least one crime, it is still useful.

[Sudden Stop]

There was a time a while back where the same group of little turds were going out every weekend filling people in, left right and centre. Usually by jumping people from behind (like the cowards they were) leaving few witnesses. These were repeat offenders committing multiple offences over quite a period of time. If they had been identified by CCTV after the first offence perhaps they could have been shown the error of their ways much earlier.

 

In some respects, CCTV is more useful in a small community like shetland than it is in cities because offenders are more likely to be identified. One hoody looks the same as the next and in a city full of thousands of them, how to know which one is which? Not so much of a problem up here, there's only a few of them to choose from and CCTV evidence could narrow the search to a very few possiblities.

[Wheesht]

^ I Agree, saves me writing.

 

( *** MOD - And the '^' saves excessive quoting *** )

 

But it lets people know what I am actually agreeing with.

[Ghostrider]

^^ Don't you think that if they had enough intelligence to only jump folk from their blindside and keep witnesses to a minimum, that they might also have had adequate intelligence to just move their activities out of camera view. Where, incidentally there was/is far, far less chance of activity being witnessed, and ditto for anyone being found that requires assistance after the fact. (Think some of the peerie trenkie hols a closs's doon ta da Esplanade).

[sheepshagger]

from the map in the paper its looks like you can get from da wheel to the taxi rank in plain view of the cameras and as this is the farthest most folk on a night out will have to walk, as long as you don't nip down a lane for a pish you will be covered should some of the little w##kers decide to jump you ala they will do the job they are designed for.

[Sudden Stop]

^^^

 

Exactly.

 

If they are intelligent enough to know where they cannot break the law, it doesn't take a genius to know where one is unlikely to be harassed. Works both ways. Probably make me feel a bit safer, as I have nothing to hide and will not be taking detours around the camera coverage.