Windycity Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 Hi, im new on this forum but have been following for some time. Didnt mean to start on a sour note, but was appaled by what i saw on the news today. Poor innocent people in Calais being torn from their only chance and freedom and possible benifits here and hardly a soul there to defend them. These people have worked hard for what they have. They come from a culture of caring and understanding, and tolerance, and could be of great benefit to this country if allowed a chance to enter. Once allowed in, their culture of tolerance would be reciprocated 10fold. They are hard working people and would intergrate easily into our society, and spread the wealth they generate to the entire community. Seeing most of them huddled in blankets as the police tore them from there makeshift homes was heart rendering, although im confused as to why no one else there seemed to be feeling the cold. The conditions they kept their camp in is testament to the kind of lifestyle they could bring to our community, and one we should all strive for. A big congrats to those people who participated in the human shield to try and keep the police from destroying their camp. These are the real heroes of the day. Forget the lives being sacrificed on foriegn shores, these folk deserve medals. They have given up a day out of their careers to be there lending a hand, a loss im certain the companies they work for would find hard to fill. Bewildered Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostrider Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 I'm not up to speed on the whole story behind the French actions, so I'll refrain from comment. However, considering the UK has somewhere in the regions of just shy of 2 1/2 Million unemployed right now, maybe we should be addressing what action needs to be taken make our own current excess baggage a bit more productive, before we invite more to stay, whether they be good, bad or indifferent. BTW. Welcome to Shetlink. Don't mind me, my bark is worse than my bite, so I'm told. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodeyn Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 Absolutely ghostrider i agree that our government should deal with our own issues b4 taking on any more. Although it is shocking what these people are having to go through their government are to blame and they need to pick up the pieces and make things right, not pass the buck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJ Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 Absolutely ghostrider i agree that our government should deal with our own issues b4 taking on any more. Although it is shocking what these people are having to go through their government are to blame and they need to pick up the pieces and make things right, not pass the buck.think you'll find many of them don't have a government, and if you look to Iraq/Afghanistan it is partially our Governments fault. edit - windycity think you and I have a different picture of the economic migrants in France.They come from a culture of caring and understanding, and tolerance, and could be of great benefit to this country if allowed a chance to enter. Once allowed in, their culture of tolerance would be reciprocated 10fold.I would love to know where this idyllic picture is coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shetlandpeat Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 The reason they were there ws to gain ulawful entry to the UK. They are not seeking assylum, as they are already in an E.U. country. We do have a system to gain entry, and it seems to work to a degree. The French are blaming the UK for their problem, but, they are on French soil. All the transients I saw interviewed were requesting UK entry to be with family and the fact we as a nation, are more caring than some others, or a push over... They would not get benefits though, so the only economic burden would be not paying tax, not paying towards any medical treatments and the cost of catching them and sending them back to port of entry in the E.U. The thing that as a nation we do need to be worried is the links with organised crime. There are many cases where these folk are lured into a Victorian work house culture for others to exploit. That is very wrong, but I dont see that that is a reason to accept all... It is the other E.U. counrties that allow these folk to travel on and find their Eden in another country, but not theirs.... The countries in the E.U. are not all singing from the same song sheet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pleepsie Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 Poor innocent people in Calais being torn from their only chance and freedom and possible benifits here and hardly a soul there to defend them. These people have worked hard for what they have. They come from a culture of caring and understanding, and tolerance, and could be of great benefit to this country if allowed a chance to enter. Once allowed in, their culture of tolerance would be reciprocated 10fold. They are hard working people and would intergrate easily into our society, and spread the wealth they generate to the entire community. If the culture they come from is so ' caring and understanding' why would they want to leave? Why not 'spread the wealth they generate ' into their own community, rather than travel huge distances to share their hard earned cash with us? The fact is that as soon as they claim asylum and have been granted leave to remain here they are eligible for most mainstream welfare services and benefits including including Income Support, Job Seekers Allowance and Housing Benefit. It is easy to see why they have Britain as their goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Styles Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 These people are economic migrants not asylum seekers. The UK should not let them in. If they were real asylum seekers they should seek asylum in the first country they reach instead of trying to make it to right across Europe to try and get in the soft touch UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibber Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 think you'll find many of them don't have a government, and if you look to Iraq/Afghanistan it is partially our Governments fault. MJ is partially right, we didn't partially go to war with Iraq and Afg did we? We fully committed to the escapade in the name of the Queen or something. If we are going to attack these countries, murder their civilians by the hundreds of thousands and steal their oil the least we could do is give the refugees of the conflict we instigated somewhere to live. These people are economic migrants not asylum seekers. The UK should not let them in. If they were real asylum seekers they should seek asylum in the first country they reach instead of trying to make it to right across Europe to try and get in the soft touch UK. But Britain is a rich country because not so long ago it stole one third of the world for itself, effectively enslaving millions of people and causing poverty for millions more. It is about time we gave something back to the world in a form other than cruise missiles and murder. Let all the refugees in, Britain owes the world recompense probably more than any other country in history with the probable exception of Germany. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Styles Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 ^^^^ We should not be made to pay and destroy our way of life for somthing that happened in the past. The Empire did good as well as bad. what about the Roman Empire? The Japanese in world war 2? Where do you stop. We owe these people nothing and should be looking out for our own citizens and country. Keep them out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibber Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 The past? its ongoing, Britain is still an occupier in territories throughout the world. Let them in, the money saved from maintaining this smoke and mirrors imperial military facade would pay for these immigrants to live a decent life in Britain hundreds of times over. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8270092.stm "The government estimates the cost of renewing Trident at about £20bn but Greenpeace says it could cost £34bn and, once lifetime running costs are included, would cost nearly £100bn in total." I'd rather my government used my taxes to keep Afghan and Iraqi citizens alive and well in Britain not dead in the desert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Styumpie Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 MJ is partially right, we didn't partially go to war with Iraq and Afg did we? We fully committed to the escapade in the name of the Queen or something. If we are going to attack these countries, murder their civilians by the hundreds of thousands and steal their oil the least we could do is give the refugees of the conflict we instigated somewhere to live. We? speak for yourself mate, I was and still am 100% against the "war" in Afghanistan and Iraq, as is and was the vast majority of the UK population. We need to sort our own problems out first, What we need to be doing is taking our country back away from this rotten dictatorship we have now, pitch forks a blazing and oust them out, set up a proper democratic ruling system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibber Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 "I was and still am 100% against the "war" in Afghanistan and Iraq, as is and was the vast majority of the UK population." I see the same government that started these wars was elected back in by the same UK population. If you are right about the vast majority then it is only to the extent that the vast majority don't want to get held up at the traffic lights or don't want to miss Strictly Come dancing. The Empire did good as well as bad. As a by product. Its easier to murder the natives if you build a nice road to get to the rebellion, its easier to steal if your troops aren't catching diseases from the indigenous population. Put Britain's looted imperial riches to good use and let immigrants in to share some of the stolen wealth. Why not try to redress the balance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malachy Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 The reason they were there ws to gain ulawful entry to the UK. They are not seeking assylum, as they are already in an E.U. country.... The French are blaming the UK for their problem, but, they are on French soil .... It is the other E.U. counrties that allow these folk to travel on and find their Eden in another country, but not theirs.... This is an argument always wheeled out by the 'keep em out' brigade. It's fine for us to say that people should stay in the first safe country they reach, because that's never going to be Britain, unless they somehow manage to circumnavigate the European continent in a canoe in order to reach us. By using this argument you're essentially saying we don't want anyone. If you're talking about asylum, Britain has to share responsibility along with all other European states for taking people in. If you read the tabloids here you'd imagine that no other country gets immigrants but it's nonsense. France, Germany, Scandinavia, they all get large numbers of asylum seekers and economic migrants. And Britain is hardly a soft touch either - asylum seekers can't work so they have to live in poverty while they wait, potentially years, for a decision. It's no wonder people break the law. There are a large number of people who want to come to Britain, but it's not because we're a soft touch, nor is it because we're seen as some kind of Eden. This country has spent the past century going round the world teaching people to speak English. We still spend large amounts of money, via the British Council and the World Service, doing exactly that. So we should hardly be surprised when people desire to come to a country whose language they can speak, or at least have some basic knowledge of. If I had to flee Britain and I could speak German, I wouldn't stop in France. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibber Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 This country has spent the past century going round the world teaching people to speak English. We still spend large amounts of money, via the British Council and the World Service, doing exactly that. So we should hardly be surprised when people desire to come to a country whose language they can speak, or at least have some basic knowledge of. A very apt point. The 'keep em out brigade' get to say both of these "they can't even speak the language" and "the only reason they come to Britain is because they can speak English" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Styumpie Posted September 23, 2009 Report Share Posted September 23, 2009 "I see the same government that started these wars was elected back in by the same UK population. If you are right about the vast majority then it is only to the extent that the vast majority don't want to get held up at the traffic lights or don't want to miss Strictly Come dancing. " Thats the whole problem, its politicians who make these decisions elected or not, it makes no difference, especially with only 2 parties to choose from there is no democracy. It will only ever be Labour or Conservative like it or lump it, what they say goes whether the populace agree or not, its not a democracy, its an elected dictatorship. We need a system where we all vote on the major issues, take the power away from politicians and hand it to the people. There should be a system in place where referendums can easily be held, some sort of secure electronic voting system, scrap ID cards and spend the money on creating such a system, it could easily be done. But sadly, dictators always hold on to power for the bitter end, they would never allow it as a true democratic system is not in their personal interests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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