Independence for Shetland!

[Wheesht]

To some degree, but not up to their necks. If the petroleum industry is developed, as is hoped, there will be no financial reliance at all. It could then be used to develop other competences for the post-petroleum era.

 

While on the other hand, and that one point settles where my vote would go, is that Shetland is now at the stage of post-petroleum competences and will soon see a reduction in revenue from the port. The last deal (1996) effectively has reduced our real income by around £6m a year. We will need the same support Faroe rely on now in around 30 years time.

 

On your point about Faroe having no reliance at all upon Denmark, in these days of power and money do you seriously think that these companies will offer a deal of anything like the proportions of the one the SIC reached with the oil companies in the 70's? I can't see it - they have everyone over one of those oil barrells.

[drognerod]

Shetland was given associated membership in the Nordic Council in about 1995; Mr. Mullay, director of Shetland Tourism at that time, told med during my visit in 1998.

As a visitor from Shetland told me here in Oslo three years ago, some delegates (or representatives) went to a first meeting, with the UK security policy tightly following their steps.

Since then nobody have heard any more about this association.

----

Seems strange to me, that the genetic research about DNA-structures at the Northern Isles ("Who were the vikings"-University project) is not more known among you debattants in Shetlink. Both in Orkney and in Shetland, around 70% showed up to have exactly the same genes at the population on the norwegian west coast. No doubt about that, this provces even more strong links to the homeland, than both in Iceland or Faraoe.

When you read some older norwegian books about visitors to Shetland, nobody should be surprised about the cultural fact, either, since people on the island knew well about their norwegian ancestors. They also knew very well about the history through the Sagas.

[Trønder]

While on the other hand, and that one point settles where my vote would go, is that Shetland is now at the stage of post-petroleum competences and will soon see a reduction in revenue from the port. The last deal (1996) effectively has reduced our real income by around £6m a year. We will need the same support Faroe rely on now in around 30 years time.

Your vote on independence? That is only relevant if Shetland currently receives all the government oil revenues from the Shetlandic continental shelf, which I doubt, because it would as an independent country. I don't know what your current "self-reliance deficit" is, but I find it hard to believe, even in the post-Peak Oil period, that the oil revenues would not be enough for 22,000 Shetlanders. The Shetlandic continental shelf would be huge compared to the population.

 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b1/Rockall_EEZ.jpg

 

New technology and a high oil price make old fields and fields that were not profitable before viable.

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/1524530.stm

 

There are also new finds.

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/4080525.stm

 

This is an important subject, if one is to consider independence for Shetland, and it would interesting to read a report on it.

 

On your point about Faroe having no reliance at all upon Denmark, in these days of power and money do you seriously think that these companies will offer a deal of anything like the proportions of the one the SIC reached with the oil companies in the 70's? I can't see it - they have everyone over one of those oil barrells.

The Faroese are in charge of their own affairs with regards to oil and gas. Exploration and drilling licences are granted by the Faroese Earth and Energy Directorate (Jarðfeingi), which has cooperated with the Norwegian Geological Survey and the Norwegian Petroleum Directorate, and the government oil revenues go unabridged to the Faroes. Two Faroese oil companies have also been established.

 

Shetland was given associated membership in the Nordic Council in about 1995; Mr. Mullay, director of Shetland Tourism at that time, told med during my visit in 1998.

As a visitor from Shetland told me here in Oslo three years ago, some delegates (or representatives) went to a first meeting, with the UK security policy tightly following their steps.

Since then nobody have heard any more about this association.

If that is the case then it should be possible to find some official references to it. Perhaps a Shetlandic delegation was invited to attend, rather than Shetland being granted associate membership?

 

Seems strange to me, that the genetic research about DNA-structures at the Northern Isles ("Who were the vikings"-University project) is not more known among you debattants in Shetlink. Both in Orkney and in Shetland, around 70% showed up to have exactly the same genes at the population on the norwegian west coast. No doubt about that, this provces even more strong links to the homeland, than both in Iceland or Faraoe.

Is this really so unknown? Wasn't it part of the BBC series Blood of the Vikings?

[Dratsy]

not acording to some sooth dr in scalloway called jennings. but then he reckons we should have a Shetland tartan

[Broichan]

I'm the Jennings fae Scalloway. I offer my abject appologies for the Shetland tartan nonsense. I only mentioned it with tongue in cheek...but some people took it way too seriously! Picts, proto-Picts and Norse were all wonderful people, I'm sure, and make worthy ancestors!

[abraxas]

70%?? Are you sure of those figures? Cos according to the study published in the American Journal of Human Genetics (carried out by Universitie of Oxford and Oslo, published 2001), the study of mitochondrial DNA in Orkney, at least, found only 35.5% similarity.

 

It seems a bit of a jump up to 70%. Or maybe that is just the true blood Viking Shetlanders who enjoy such purity.

[abraxas]

Aparently it was around 44% fer Shetland when they did the study. No' bad considerin Iceland has only 37.5%! But then the remoteness an -ahem! - intermarrying would account fer a bit o that.

[Trønder]

70%?? Are you sure of those figures?

Actually it was 60% of the Y chromosomes in Orkney and Shetland that came from Western Norway, 30% in Durness in the Hebrides and 15% in the Isle of Man, all having been subject to the Norwegian crown.

 

http://www.orkneyjar.com/history/vikingorkney/genetics.htm

 

Cos according to the study published in the American Journal of Human Genetics (carried out by Universitie of Oxford and Oslo, published 2001), the study of mitochondrial DNA in Orkney, at least, found only 35.5% similarity.

Aparently it was around 44% fer Shetland when they did the study. No' bad considerin Iceland has only 37.5%! But then the remoteness an -ahem! - intermarrying would account fer a bit o that.

This study has similar numbers for Orkney and Shetland, but quite a bit higher for Iceland.

 

http://www.nature.com/hdy/journal/v95/n2/abs/6800661a.html

[rutip]

Regarding genetics in the North Atlantic.

 

Seems like the Faroese are a bit more British than Scandinavian, actually 55/45 - British/Scandinavian

 

I read this in a book called "Faroe Islands Today":

 

Research projects showed that the male population (of Faroe) is of 80% Nordic (most likely Norwegian) origin, while the women only have 10%. The rest, 20% of men and 90% of women, are of British (Celtic) origin.

Aesthetic voices opine that this explains why Faroe women are particularly pretty, which may not to the same extent be said of the men.

 

A compliment to the Norwegians indeed

 

Article: http://www.nature.com/ejhg/journal/v14/n4/full/5201578a.html

[TYR/RAGNAROK]

abraxis wrat

See! Shocked I told yez we were here first! Now, all o yez "Vikings"... GER ORF MOI LAAAAAND!!! Very Happy

 

my question is...is du a pict? or dus du class desel in dat genepool? cos if du dus, lik du seems tae com across as, den du cood b da contendir for claiming wryts tae shaetlan.

 

derick wrat

Da fok at focuses on da brief period (six hunder year ago!!!) at Shetlan wisna pairt o Scotland, is joost Brit Unionist agitators, nautheen more.

 

600 year ago wisna joost dat lang ago if du tinks aboot hit! an whit da hel is a Brit Unionist Agitator? am joost interested in aa body learnin sheatlans dam history an makin up dir ain mynd as tae whit day want tae du wi da info dat day hiv learnd, an if dat leads tae independance or a less Scotti controllin regime dat wid benefit wis shaetlandirs an da islands demsels, den dat shurli is a good ting, o coors fur da fok dat ar on dis dat hiv com fae sooth, yu ar bound tae want tae stick wi scotland or whitiver dats yur choice but i tink hits aboot tyme shaetland wis geen da chance tae learn an decide properly wi complete knowledge fur hitsel!.

 

Ghostridir wrat

is flitein and fighting over the historical shenanigans all that important in the present?

 

YIS hit is. I tink dat afore shaetland kin gae forwird den hit shood look bak on da past an learn, decide whits wryt an wrang den look forward an mak da ryt decishuns dat wil benefit hit an no ony iddir countries!

shaetlan an wis shaetlandirs comes first fur a change!

[Trønder]

Of course, we shouldn't forget that the explanation for British genes in the pre-industrial era "West Norse" islands can be just as much a result of Norse-British intermarriage and Norse men taking British slave women as a remains of a previous British population. No doubt you will find British genes in mainland Norway as well. I doubt that we will ever get the complete picture, not that it is really important to the identity building of today.

[Trønder]

600 year ago wisna joost dat lang ago if du tinks aboot hit!

538, actually...

[abraxas]

T/R,

 

You are so right. I mean, 1407 seems like just yesterday to me. As I recall saying to those young roisterdoisters, Henry (IV) and Jamesy (I), "Henry", I said, "Jamesy, someday we'll look back on all this and larf!" Snif! Yup, a blink of an eye. And not much of any import has happened in between, either.

 

Sheesh, if 600 years isn't that long to yez, d'yez think ye can persuade me bank te start some mortgages along these lines? Mind, the way things is goin, it can't be that long before they do!!

 

Let's keep a sense o perspective, shall we. SIX. HUNDRED. YEARS. Practically the feckn DARK AGES. The same century in which they burnt Joan o Arc an had the War o the Roses.

 

Gimme strength.

 

Look back afore we look forwards? Fine. Let's just not LIVE THERE. (Yes, I know I'm shoutin, but can yez blame me?!)

 

If we follow yer supremely logical ( ) argument, we should also go to war with the French (cuz we was back then), burn strange women at the stake (cuz we did back then), go to war with the Ottomans (okay, granted, history CAN repeat itself ), expel an persecute Jews... hell, the list goes on an on, just cuz some folk can't deal with reality an want te take us back te before a piece o paper was or wasn't signed, or islands were or weren't given over te another country???

 

Give the man a Nobel prize!!

[Roachmill]

o coors fur da fok dat ar on dis dat hiv com fae sooth, yu ar bound tae want tae stick wi scotland or whitiver dats yur choice

Why are we bound to do that? Is there a law I dinnae ken about?

[sheepshagger]

A couple of quotes from abraxas

 

Man, I'm not a Scot. I'm Irish/Canuckois/Wood Cree/French, but ain't no Scots in there

 

 

See! I told yez we were here first! Now, all o yez "Vikings"... GER ORF MOI LAAAAAND!!!

 

First your some kind a mongrel then your a pict bit contradictory of yourself abraxas