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Independence for Shetland!


Jonners
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Where do you stand?  

128 members have voted

  1. 1. Where do you stand?

    • Full independence
      55
    • Crown dependency
      30
    • Keep the status quo
      47


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Njuggle is spot on, you're stuck ida rut o "focus on what has been done and not what could be done". Catch up.

 

Is far is Im cunsairned dir nae rut, weer stikkin whaur we ir bekais hits da ill-best o a bad lot. Da statis qo is dohibl we sae faur, da idder illternitives eenoo ir a sot waur.

 

We ir luikin ahead a sae faur is whit we sud duh sud da scotties gyeen fur hom rool, an dunna sae hits no idda offin tae wye ur da tidder, bekais if hits no da Skottish Neshinils ir da grittist bawnd a leeirs it ivver woar blak sho ledder, is hits been dir bye wird fae da dae dey wir boarn.

 

Sud home rool cum ta pass, an takkin akoont a Scottie rool athin Shetlin baith a time past an da wye he's luikin idda ert eenoo, bein onywye idder wye ill be a sicht bettir is bein athin da same bul is dem. Whiddir dat meens hom rool fur wis, hom rool fur wis alang wi sum idder Isle, or bidin wi Inglin, ill depend upoa whit luiks da ill-best cum den.

 

Weer mebber no ower-weel is is, bit weer livibil. Dir is nae need ta duh onythin aless sumeen idder dus sumthin first, den we man luik oot fur wir ain.

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Originally published here

 

?

 

Stuart Hill (65) gained some media attention with his proclaimed intention to argue in Lerwick Sheriff Court on 25 March 2008 that the court had no jurisdiction since the Shetland Isles are not in law part of Scotland or subject to Scots law.

 

He was being sued in a small claims action by a local accountancy firm called A9 for non-payment of fees. Mr Hill’s argument was based on the unredeemed impignoration of the islands by the Danish to the Scottish Crown in 1469 on the occasion of King James III’s marriage to a daughter of King Christian of Denmark; the suggestion is that this means Shetland was not owned by the Scottish or its successor British state.

 

The case was however postponed for a month as a result of the sheriff for whom it had been set down becoming snow-bound on the mainland, and on 20 April it was reported that Mr Hill had decided to settle with the pursuers and seek another occasion upon which to advance his historical and jurisdictional claims. Possibly by this time he had had an opportunity to consult the article on Udal Law in volume 24 of the Stair Memorial Encyclopaedia, which fairly comprehensively demolishes the argument that Mr Hill intended to put forward, clarifying the key distinction between dominium and sovereignty.

 

Mr Hill has lived in Shetland since being shipwrecked there in 2001, the ignominious end to an ill-fated attempt to sail round Britain anti-clockwise in his 15-foot converted rowing boat with a windsurfing sail. His misadventures en route gave rise to the media nickname “Captain Calamity” even before the final capsize of the vessel off Shetland (see http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/1503308.stm).

 

Mr Hill now runs a website called The Shetland Conversation, apparently dedicated to the cause of independence for Shetland, and you can keep up with his campaign at http://www.shetlandconversation.com.

 

The pages within the quoted volume of the Stair Memorial Encyclopedia are:

Sellar, W. David H. (ed.) 1989. Udal law. In: The Laws of Scotland: Stair Memorial Encyclopaedia vol. 24, 193-230. Law Society of Scotland/Butterworths, Edinburgh.

should anyone have access to it?!

 

Checking out Amazon for volume 23 :shock:

 

The Laws of Scotland: Stair Memorial Encyclopaedia: Vol.23 (Hardcover)

by Robert Black (Editor), Hamish Henderson (Editor), Joseph M. Thomson (Editor), Kenneth Miller (Editor)

No customer reviews yet. Be the first.

Price: £2,990.00 + £1.99 sourcing fee

 

You'd need to go to a Uni library and or the National library or somesuch methinks!

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[

 

The pages within the quoted volume of the Stair Memorial Encyclopedia are:

Sellar, W. David H. (ed.) 1989. Udal law. In: The Laws of Scotland: Stair Memorial Encyclopaedia vol. 24, 193-230. Law Society of Scotland/Butterworths, Edinburgh.

should anyone have access to it?!

 

You'd need to go to a Uni library and or the National library or somesuch methinks!

 

Further to my earlier post I checked in the Shetland Library today and they have that very edition! Brian Smith had a part in the writing of the article so you can imagine the line it takes.

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What am i missing? If shetland gained "independence" on historical grounds from the UK, surely it would fall back to Norway, with a degree of Udal rule, not become independent, as such? Udal law might gain us rights to the nearby seabed off the shore of the croft but, if drawing from pre-dowry times, surely our crown would be atil Norge? :?

 

Correct me somebody - -Brian? Anybody?

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^^ I assume (a dangerous habit I know :? ) that somewhere along the way the assumption (there's that dangerous habit again :?) has been made, that *if* Scotland/U.K. have been holding us illegally for over 500 years they certainly have no claim to us, and as Norway/Denmark have made no significantly serious attempts to regain us during the same period, that they don't particularly want us. Therefor, it would seem logical we call the shots as to our own status and alligences.

 

If all that all this talk of independence and Udal Law boils down to is about getting ahold of seabed ownership, then it would seem to me the most obvious avenue to pursue it has been overlooked. Thankfully I did not choose law as a profession, however, and I am sure anyone familiar with the finer points of law will soon correct me if I'm wrong, I have been been told by numerous people that Shetland already holds a unique position (Orkney may also share it, this I have never heard discussed) in law concerning the foreshore, with it's basis stretching back to Udal law. Insofar as in the rest of the UK a landowner only owns to the point of highest high water, but in Shetland a landowner owns to the point of lowest low water.

 

*If* this is indeed correct, then it would seem to me that the precedent for foreshore, and from there by extension, seabed ownership, being different in Shetland than in the rest of the UK already exists, and it might just be a whole lot productive to capitalise on that precedent (*if* it is true) and try and use it as stepping stone for extending the ownership further offshore, than it might be by getting entangled in the whole independence etc thing.

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>>Brian Smith had a part in the writing of the article so you can imagine the line it takes.

 

So whit line does da article tak, Joannie? please enlighten wis. In fact, haved you read it??

 

I didn't take any notes at the time but it states that Udal law had applied in Shetland but had never been fully tested in the courts. I recall reading an article about it by Brian Smith and it seemed to support the same contention that UK law applied in the Shetland.

 

My main objective in the post was to advise the readers of this forum that the book was easily accessible in Shetland. My intention in mentioning Brian Smith's involvement was merely to show that the article had the credibiity of having the involvement of someone who knew what he was speaking about.

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Is far is Im cunsairned dir nae rut, weer stikkin whaur we ir bekais hits da ill-best o a bad lot. Da statis qo is dohibl we sae faur, da idder illternitives eenoo ir a sot waur.

whit wey does du keen dat?? Becis certain 'Scotties' hunders a years ago wis Black Hat Baddies? As if dey wirna an irna bad aipples among 'pure' Shelties! hah!

 

An whit exactly does dat hae ta dae wi da day, an da moarn?? No a hel o a lot, unless you believe in racial type theories.

 

dis, an dy previous comment at things is only improved in Shetlan fae London took an interest (as though dey hed taen an interest in wirkin fok onywhaur afore dat!) soonds joost laek a rural version oda Scottish Cringe.

 

if hits no da Skottish Neshinils ir da grittist bawnd a leeirs it ivver woar blak sho ledder, is hits been dir bye wird fae da dae dey wir boarn.

 

Boy! du's shurly been takkin lessons in mainners (lack o) fae Sheepshagger!! Wun shall rise abuin it.

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What am i missing? If shetland gained "independence" on historical grounds from the UK, surely it would fall back to Norway, with a degree of Udal rule, not become independent, as such? Udal law might gain us rights to the nearby seabed off the shore of the croft but, if drawing from pre-dowry times, surely our crown would be atil Norge? :?

 

Correct me somebody - -Brian? Anybody?

 

Incorrect: Innse Cataibh/Cattaland wis thieved fae Pictlaund bi hairy ersed proto Norskis - hence it belongs ta Scotland. Du's shurly no wantin ta reward a baund o thieves an murderers??

 

But wha nicked it fae da Cro-Magnons???

 

Also Neandethal-laund clearly haes a clear cleem tae da seabed/foarmer dry laund.

 

An da Romans, dunna get me startit on da Romans!!

 

Nivver you mind boys, you can become subjects oda Keeng o "Forvik" nou. ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. dear God. ha ha ha ha

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  • 4 months later...

Love all the people commenting underneath the article about this being some sort of unionist conspiracy. Confirms my prejudice that people who use the comments section under news articles very rarely have a clue!

 

As for people who use internet discussion forums ... well, that's a different kettle of fish altogether. :wink:

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