Save Shetland Coastguard

[Guest Anonymous]

maybe their boss has had a word with them

[NorthStar]

Time to get your head out of the sand peeps.

 

Technology is advancing and Im afraid to say there is no requirement for 19 Stations around the UK, you cant deny that !.

 

Satcom fits now are small and are able to be installed anywhere, even inside buildings and there is no need for the type that were installed previously in Unst. Look how many vessels are satcom fitted nowadays.

 

The only thing that cant be knocked down is local knowledge, however since there might be day station staff available, its a call to them for any knowledge requirements.

 

Yes the MCA have gone over the top, more realistic numbers would be 10 mainland MRCC's and no day stations, thus more reslience.

 

Lets face it too, you didnt help your case when you didnt take industrial action did you, you got stabbed in the back from the MCA as their way of saying thanks for a job well done.

 

As I said, your only hope is Local knowledge, by using small SATCOM units the technology is available now to maintain good and adequate comms until such time as the day station staff can be roused to give further assistance.

 

Face up to reality, times have moved on

[Egbert-Mcwhirter]

In response to Northstar you are forgetting about the many small pleasure craft and fishing boats who have no satcoms fit they may just have a VHF set and mobile phone for communications.

The staff at Shetland Coastguard should not continue to be criticised just because they didn't go on strike. Even if they had done it probably wouldn't have made the slightest difference.

[NorthStar]

The satcom equipment is adaptable to be used to trigger the relevant aerial sites, instead of being hard wired it would be by satcom. Op at MOC, calls on aerial site up to sat down to terminal out on aerial site....

 

As I maintain, local knowledge is the only thing that is likely to keep stations opened.

[skippy]

The satcom equipment is adaptable to be used to trigger the relevant aerial sites, instead of being hard wired it would be by satcom. Op at MOC, calls on aerial site up to sat down to terminal out on aerial site....

 

As I maintain, local knowledge is the only thing that is likely to keep stations opened.

 

While satcom sets are more than advanced enough to do the job as you have said Northstar the fact is that the coastguard reorganisation/cuts make no mention of using any new technology to manage their remote antenna sites or pager systems.

I am sure there IS a technological answer to the Shetland communications problems but whatever it is, it is NOT being implemented and in fact the HMCG HQ has specifically said they will be using the existing BT kilostream microwave links to manage the sites in the future .... thats the whole point.

As has been said in many posts the fact that the reorganisation is taking place is not the problem .... the reduction in service levels and reliability is.

 

and AFAIK the Shetland CG staff have been and still are taking industrial action in support of their unions. The fact they chose not to walk out when that decision could have cost a life or lives in these busy waters is a point in their favour. As a professional seafarer I for one appreciate that they put their duty above their pay!

[NorthStar]

[While satcom sets are more than advanced to do the job as you have said Northstar the fact is that the coastguard reorganisation/cuts make no mention of using any new technology to manage their remote antenna sites or pager systems.

Wether it be the politians or the MCA the word will be 'the technolgy is available to allow us to achieve this' Questions answered

I am sure there IS a technological answer to the Shetland communications problems but whatever it is, it is NOT being implemented and in fact the HMCG HQ has specifically said they will be using the existing BT kilostream microwave links to manage the sites in the future

I for one have no faith in what the MCA state after reading this document, if they want to do something they will say anything to achieve it. Between the end of this discussion document and the final station closures they will be able to move the goal posts to their requirement.

 

As has been said in many posts the fact that the reorganisation is taking place is not the problem .... the reduction in service levels and reliability is.

We cannot yet confirm there will be any reduction in service and reliability yet, this can only be achieved when the MCA undertake a full and comprehensive trial and risk assessment in their proposals, something they have yet to do. Yes I am against these proposals but we have to be realistic, there is no requirement for 19 stations admit it, 10 or 8 max.

 

(Union point not being taken up as its not constructive)

[skippy]

I for one have no faith in what the MCA state after reading this document, if they want to do something they will say anything to achieve it. Between the end of this discussion document and the final station closures they will be able to move the goal posts to their requirement.

 

Of that I have no doubt ..... we are in agreement

 

 

We cannot yet confirm there will be any reduction in service and reliability yet, this can only be achieved when the MCA undertake a full and comprehensive trial and risk assessment in their proposals, something they have yet to do. Yes I am against these proposals but we have to be realistic, there is no requirement for 19 stations admit it, 10 or 8 max.

 

I have never said that reorganisation was undesirable .... in fact I will say that it is necessary to keep the service moving forward .. and yes, technological advances with fiber broadband links to remote antennas or other secure and reliable means of communications make it possible for future reorganisation to take place although the loss of jobs is s*** especially for those directly affected. However those secure communications have been overlooked OR LIED about in the presented proposals and no action or proposal to retain local knowledge has been forthcoming either.

 

I think we have much to agree on here ... but you also should see that the proposed cuts have holes in you could drive the Braer through!

[NorthStar]

Much agreed however some would not be so willing to accept these or any changes. The writing is on the 'bog' wall and putting kilroy was here doesnt hold anymore, the strongest point, as I mentioned earlier, is to push the local knowledge factor and that calling the RNLI or a local CRO is not plausible.

 

We are hitting a brick wall however when one high placed states 'There is nothing we do that is that urgent'.

[Northerly]

In response to Northstar you are forgetting about the many small pleasure craft and fishing boats who have no satcoms fit they may just have a VHF set and mobile phone for communications.

The staff at Shetland Coastguard should not continue to be criticised just because they didn't go on strike. Even if they had done it probably wouldn't have made the slightest difference.

 

You are right, it would not have made the slightest bit of difference, in fact, all that the strike has done has made it more likely that this would happen. When the MCA Management tried to run the whole of the UK from the Training Centre at Highcliffe during the strikes, they found that actually they could not. Centralising everything in two MOC's has as much to do with making it easier to do just that and being able to undermine future industrial action as it has to do with any 'resilience.' Radical change has been mooted for years but it was the strike that gave it impetus. The only resilience that is lacking is managements current inability to undermine industrial action, they intend to make sure that doesn't happen in future.

[Muppet]

As I said, your only hope is Local knowledge, by using small SATCOM units the technology is available now to maintain good and adequate comms until such time as the day station staff can be roused to give further assistance.

 

Face up to reality, times have moved on

 

So what your saying in essence is that Shetland staff should only be paid daytime but need to be avaialable 24/7

 

That says a lot really!

[Muppet]

We cannot yet confirm there will be any reduction in service and reliability yet,

 

Are you happy to wait until the first loss of life to confirm this?

 

I for one am not.

[Muppet]

Technology is advancing and Im afraid to say there is no requirement for 19 Stations around the UK, you cant deny that !.

 

 

I won't argue with you there, but the current proposals are very much a step too far.

[Northerly]

Interesting statistic from the figures released under FOIA:

 

Excluding London (which is a small station covering the Thames whose status is not in any way changing),

 

Shetland MRCC showed the greatest increase in incidents dealt with from 2009 to 2010, an increase of 13%

 

Belfast was next at 12%.

[NorthStar]

So what your saying in essence is that Shetland staff should only be paid daytime but need to be avaialable 24/7

 

That says a lot really!

 

You know as well as me, that there is likely to be an in built allowance just for that type of thing, call it on call allowance, bell allowance or goodwill allowance. We are reknown for showing good will and they will use it.

 

Are you happy to wait until the first loss of life to confirm this? I for one am not

I would not be happy however nor can you prove otherwise.

 

 

I won't argue with you there, but the current proposals are very much a step too far.

As I said it is a step too far, a more realistic 8 or 10 MRCC's would be more resilience

 

You are right, it would not have made the slightest bit of difference, in fact, all that the strike has done has made it more likely that this would happen. When the MCA Management tried to run the whole of the UK from the Training Centre at Highcliffe during the strikes, they found that actually they could not. Centralising everything in two MOC's has as much to do with making it easier to do just that and being able to undermine future industrial action as it has to do with any 'resilience.' Radical change has been mooted for years but it was the strike that gave it impetus. The only resilience that is lacking is managements current inability to undermine industrial action, they intend to make sure that doesn't happen in future.

Since you raised it again when I closed it....Can you prove it would not have made any difference, if for example every station had shown solidarity then the MCA's attempt at manning the coast would have fallen at the first hurdle. The MCA did not attempt at running the whole system from the Training center, it was left to various employees to run a type of service from various locations, there would have been no option but to enter into real dialogue and not just the lip service given.

 

With the gaffs that have been launched by the CEO and his side kick RJ I fear that not even fatalities will change the course of action or intentions of the MCA. Their words 'its a done deal', the last Transport Minister is reported to have said when challenged over these ones 'at least we had 3 MOC's'.

 

Yes I am calling for the MCA to be brought back to the table to create new and real propoals, but I am sorry to say that even I realise that change is necessary and we can no longer maintain a 19 station system. For Scotland along we should reduce to 2 mainland MRCC's one in the central belt on in Inverness area. The excuse of 'communications problems' doesnt cut anymore, you might not like it but that is life.

 

Do you really want to go down the Statistics road, Shetlands increase of 12 pct of the national or of Shetlands own stats? You might believe you will get it changed, Im looking at it with rationale, what is going to happen in Scotland is Forth, Clyde and yourself will close. Aberdeen the MOC and Stornoway the day station. Stornoway because the western seaboard needs covering and Aberdeen cant handle it.

[NorthStar]

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