meeting quorums

[sailor]

http://www.shetnews.co.uk/news/1231-questions-raised-over-trust-quorum.html

 

Can you state you aren't part of a meeting and still be counted?

[Spinner72]

Apparently the official line they are going with is the very literal interpetation that if 12 people are "present", as in, sitting at the table, then a decision can be made.

 

The very idea that, in todays climate, the Charitable Trust/Council can make a decision costing over £400,000 based on where one of the members happened to be sitting is mind boggling. But, sadly, not just apparently true, but entirely typical..

[Ghostrider]

^^ I would guess it would come down to the legal definition of "present" in that case. There were 12 actually there at the meeting and vote (a quorum), there were only 11 participating in the meeting and vote (inquorate).

 

To have prevented any confusion Frank Robertson should have walked out with John Scott, or as he admitted himself later, removed himself to the public seats. By remaining in the members seats he was in an ambigious position. He was in doing so declaring himself to be a "member", he had indicated he was not going to be participating, but by remaining as a "member" he was in effect appearing to be reserving his right to rescind his right not to particpate at any time.

 

As Spinner72 says, its a hell of a poor way to run a business.

[man of kent]

How frustrating it must be to be living in Shetland these days, you cant trust anyone, they seem to pull all sorts of tricks just to get their way. If this guy wasn't part of the membership the vote and meeting should be declared null and void.

 

Viking Energy must be laughing all the way to the bank!

[stilldellin]

^^

How frustrating it must be to be living in Shetland these days, you cant trust anyone, they seem to pull all sorts of tricks just to get their way. If this guy wasn't part of the membership the vote and meeting should be declared null and void.

 

Viking Energy must be laughing all the way to the bank!

Exactly,man of kent, some of us just shake our heads, shrug our shoulders and get on with it in the hope that one day the blind leading the blind will come to an end. !

[JustMe]

This should not have happened and it really ought to have been up to the paid officials to get Frank Robertson to clarify his position. I suppose if he was sitting in his seat as a member even though he had said he would not vote then he was present and the meeting was quorate. But is that what he intended by remaining in his seat?.

 

In practical terms I guess this makes little difference as I am sure an emergency meeting would have been called and Viking Energy would have just had to wait a little longer for the money.

[shetlandpeat]

You need a Cabinet which comes with a Scrutiny Committee. It cuts some of the red tape and installs some accountability.

 

a suggestion.

 

If a councillor is not at a meeting, then they should be physically not there. To sit in you allotted seat, I guess with id badge and table place is quite wrong.

I wonder if the same accusation would be made if the vote went the other way???

[Ghostrider]

In practical terms I guess this makes little difference as I am sure an emergency meeting would have been called and Viking Energy would have just had to wait a little longer for the money.

 

You're very probably right. All it does is prove yet one more time, as if it was needed, that the CT is run as a chaotic farce.

 

In theory, even if it is unwise and a high risk arrangement, its quite possible for the same people to be councillors and CT trustees, and operate both entities competently and fairly. All it takes is for each individual to remove from their mind anything and everything concerning the other entity, whenever they're in a meeting of either the CT or SIC.

 

In practice any demarcation between entities has been difficult to impossible to find for many, many years, and at best it was only ever a pretty fuzzy line.

[Spinner72]

This should not have happened and it really ought to have been up to the paid officials to get Frank Robertson to clarify his position.

 

Absolutely. And in almost any other council, that would have happened.

 

However, as I have mentioned before, Shetland, as far as I have seen, is almost unique in that the paid, fully qualified officials are for all intents and purposes secondary in the chain of command to elected members.

 

Redressing this situation is the most obvious and necessary step in rectifying many of the problems that exist withing the council, especially relating to budgets.

 

(eg. paid official decides their department cannot include a project this financial year because they cannot afford it - councilors then decide it has to be done no matter what - paid official has to go over-budget to do as they demand, or cut something they, as a qualified, experienced officer, had decided was more important)

[man of kent]

If it wasn't so serious, I'd ask if Brian Rix and a few others were elected members of both the Charitable Trust and also the Council.

 

I think a few hard times are about to fall on my beloved homeland along with a few tough decisions that need to be made, and stuck to.

Someone with enough power and determination needs to change not only the "elected people" but also the system which allows it to happen in the first place. You have to wonder who is making money out of all this?