Ghostrider Posted August 26, 2011 Report Share Posted August 26, 2011 Give them religious education, let them decide if its truth, part truth or a good selling book that has loads of stories in it? If its genuinely "religious education" ie. educating about the historical and social influences of all faiths, thats fine. When its "taught" (as it was by any and all RE I was ever forced to sit through) by CoS and Baptist Ministers, the Methodist Ministers wife, an elder of the Kirk, and as often as not took the form of praying and singing christian hyms, it has little to do with "education", and much to do with pushing a particular flavour of fantasy. On the bright side though, considering how few "recruits" and how many anti-religion individuals were created among those of us who were forced to sit through a dumbed down church service every week, and pray multiple times every day, they haven't been doing a very good job at "teaching" it for a very long time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the pursuit of oblivion Posted August 27, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 [quote For instance, I have recently heard a tale about comments made to children at the summer Christian kids camp, which I hope are untrue or exaggerated. Because, if not, things have not changed at all and what was said is repulsive and disgusting in its lack of morality. quote] Have tried to avoid this area as I felt it best to be tolerant and not cause ruptions about this camp even tho they were allowed into school to persuade kids to come to it. After some of the comments on this thread tho I felt the need to do a little digging. 1. They were shown real pictures of people crucified and told the people who did this to Jesus were sinners - I guess this is the Jews someone was referring to here as being chastised. 2. One leader held two fireworks and spoke about the big bang, then produced a wristwatch and asked the kids how they thought a watch could possibly come from a huge explosion. This is the blind watch maker analogy I guess we all know about. 3. People who didn't believe in god were labelled sinners and hell and damnation were spoken about for those who didn’t believe. 4. Some other leaders left because they couldn't condone the actions of some of the more prothelysing leaders who were giving out this stuff. There may be more but I was probing very gently and didn’t want to make too much of an issue about it with him. This all from a reliable, sensible young kid who was there who didn't have a scooby about religion but now doesn't know whether to believe or not in case he will go to hell! Excuse the pun but thank god I didn't allow our kids to attend. The main point here and relevance to this thread is that the schools openly allowed these people to interrupt lessons and use education time to persuade the kids to attend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJ Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 I needed to sign a bit of paper to allow my child to the christian youth camp talk in school. the behaviour listed sounds extreme, reminds me of my brother at five unable to sleep as at school he was told that anyone not baptised would go straight to Hell (including his pets). after similar complaints from other parents that minister was not allowed to teach RE in school again. But my main question is why are people objecting now to religious representatives NOW? Because Johnatan's got a bee in his bonnet? yes the committee structure has changed, it does often, but there has always been religious representatives on the committees. I remember the Shetland Youth Forum having a member who was the Catholic representative on one of the Education committees many years ago, she saw it as a way of representing both. I do wonder if the folks who voted for Jonathan didn't get what they deserved. He seems more and more to be aping the snotty teenager throwing little (and rather bigger more expensive) tantrums when ever he doesn't get his own way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaflech Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 [quote For instance, I have recently heard a tale about comments made to children at the summer Christian kids camp, which I hope are untrue or exaggerated. Because, if not, things have not changed at all and what was said is repulsive and disgusting in its lack of morality. quote] Have tried to avoid this area as I felt it best to be tolerant and not cause ruptions about this camp even tho they were allowed into school to persuade kids to come to it. After some of the comments on this thread tho I felt the need to do a little digging. 1. They were shown real pictures of people crucified and told the people who did this to Jesus were sinners - I guess this is the Jews someone was referring to here as being chastised. 2. One leader held two fireworks and spoke about the big bang, then produced a wristwatch and asked the kids how they thought a watch could possibly come from a huge explosion. This is the blind watch maker analogy I guess we all know about. 3. People who didn't believe in god were labelled sinners and hell and damnation were spoken about for those who didn’t believe. 4. Some other leaders left because they couldn't condone the actions of some of the more prothelysing leaders who were giving out this stuff. There may be more but I was probing very gently and didn’t want to make too much of an issue about it with him. This all from a reliable, sensible young kid who was there who didn't have a scooby about religion but now doesn't know whether to believe or not in case he will go to hell! Excuse the pun but thank god I didn't allow our kids to attend. The main point here and relevance to this thread is that the schools openly allowed these people to interrupt lessons and use education time to persuade the kids to attend. If that is the gist of the bilge that was being 'taught' there then I think the people responsible should be charged with child abuse. This sounds typical of the arrogance and ignorance associated with these extremists. Religion purports to be all-accepting and all-tolerant, but it seems to fall down slightly if you believe in another imaginary deity, or worse still if you are like me, an Atheist, then you will burn for eternity, (although they fail to see the irony if you don't believe in it.....) As said before on this thread, it exists as it has done for millennia to control people through power and fear. For a more humourous but nevertheless true take on the whole thing, look up comedians George Carlin and Bill Hicks on religion. They have it nailed, but with some sweary words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the pursuit of oblivion Posted August 27, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 Sorry to be back on aboot this but am no sure if something really serously bad has gone on at this summer camp. Noo fun oot da bairns were explicitally told all other religions outwith christianity were created by satan! shown actual photographs of real crucifixion leaders breaking down in tears when reading the bible to the bairns constant reminders of damnation for not believing no my bairn tho so I dunna want to interfere but I feel I should post it here as a warning to all those who may consider sending bairns to this "innocent" event another year ! if anybody reading this is in authority then there should be a serious investigation into this! - and the fact they were allowed into school to persuade kids to attend on the premise of having a fun time! I actually wonder if it's a matter for the police? Anybody know ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoots Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 What I was told fits with what was said about Jews and the Crucifixion but it went further in that i believe the bairn said they were told God doesn't love the Jews and doesn't want them in this world!! Even if that wasn't what was actually said, it shows the problem this sort of thing causes. If a bairn is left confused enough to report this, these people are causing great distress and harm even to kids at a critical developmental time. Your adult behavior is programmed in your childhood - obviously. So what are they achieving? Or trying to achieve? It could easily lead to hatred and prejudice. Incitement?? If I was one of the parents I'd be writing or phoning head of schools to kick up a stink. A wee investigation at that level might prevent any of the disgusting indoctrination of wee kids being allowed again. They should stop these camps from being pushed or getting inputs on them in all the schools. Let them advertise in the paper or in their church. Then if folk still want to go or send their kids, let them. Love thy neighbour? Yeah, only if they're the same branch of Christianity as you!! I can't believe this goes on in Shetland, and is allowed to go on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OP8S Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 It certainly seems to have been a platform for inciting extreme views on impressionable young minds to say the least. The parents who sent their kids to this youthcamp surely must of known what they were letting them in for, I can't imagine anybody who does not hold the same ideals leaving their loved ones at the mercy of the right-wing christian brigade, or maybe they thought it was a cheap way of providing childcare through the holidays ? I certainly hope that the campfire was fuelled by peat & not copies of the Koran... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoots Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 Their disdain extends to ALL of us who don't go to their church it seems, not just Muslims, but Jews seem to get it extra hard. Who actually runs the thing? Which bunch? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the pursuit of oblivion Posted August 27, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 It certainly seems to have been a platform for inciting extreme views on impressionable young minds to say the least. The parents who sent their kids to this youthcamp surely must of known what they were letting them in for: That was the problem op8s, they came to the school and addressed the kids and told them it was a fun summer camp with the religion element being down played. I really don't think parents did expect this crazy stuff to be going on. With them being allowed into the school it gave a kind of false assurance that this was quasi approved and therefore not something too extreme. In actual affect it's turned out to be just about as extreme as you can get with this stuff! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostrider Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 Who actually runs the thing? Which bunch? As far as I can see they don't explicitly state their denomination, but by describing themselves as "run by Christians from Gospel Halls" they would infer, in my mind at least, a leaning, at least, towards the Brethren. http://www.shetlandcamp.com/index.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OP8S Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 Shetland fundamentalist christian society One can only shake their heads in dis-belief ( no pun intended ) that people in the Shetland community still hold such views. Whatever happened to love thy neighbour, I thought that was quite a well accepted part of christianity. It appears not though. Very sad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spinner72 Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 If that is the gist of the bilge that was being 'taught' there then I think the people responsible should be charged with child abuse. I have had this opinion for quite some time. There was a documentary made a few years ago on an american "Jesus Camp" as they call them. I honestly believe its the most disturbing thing I have ever seen. Of course, such things are biased but you can't deny whats being filmed. The very idea that a similar camp is being run here is terrifying!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambo6 Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 My daughters experience does not reflect that mentioned above. She was taught about other religions and told to treat them with respect, the hellfire and damnation on us heathens - yes, the rest no. I realise that different weeks would have had different tutors, so I guess she got "lucky", if you can call being told your Dad is going to hell lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostrider Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 ......hellfire and damnation on us heathens..... I'll take it. It sure beats the sitting on a cloud playing a harp, while wearing a white goonie and having a damn great pair of wings nailed to your back, the god camp put about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAStewart Posted August 27, 2011 Report Share Posted August 27, 2011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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