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Israel vs. Middle Eastern Arab states

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the mod said this thread did not break the terms and conditions. but i suggest that it does -defamatory, abusive, vulgar, hateful.


I counter claim that this is all I've heard out of 'you' since you got here and getting the views of another censored is a poor last resort to hide behind in order for your opinion to prevail.

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i would recommend you study the law on incitement to racial and religious hatred. if these posting dont break this law what would.

im very disappointed

these views are so so stupid

it should have been closed down


But I was on a special invite


C'mon lets hear and see the truth from your own face, quoting the original and best anti-Semitic conspiracy theory publication of them all.


I dare you.


Thing is I never thought about its validaity before and likewise thought it antisemitic gibberish.

On inspection of the facts however, many glaring anomalys and holes become evident all to quick. I dont see how evidence contrary to popular opinion is automatically anti-Semitic or why it would make anyone who has become convinced by it instantly racist after a lifetime of being totally opposed to such viewpoints.

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It is interesting to note that britain joined the war over one country invading another yet the end result conclusion is that Israel can invade Palestine.


Ben Gurion supported the proposal to partition Palestine into a Jewish and an Arab state. At the same time, he delivered speeches which made it clear that he did not accept partition as a final solution: 'If I had been faced with the question: a Jewish state in the west of the land of Israel in return for giving up on our historical right to the entire land of Israel I would have postponed the establishment of the state. No Jew is entitled to give up the right of the Jewish nation to the land. It is not in the authority of any Jew or of any Jewish body; it is not even in the authority of the entire nation alive today to give up any part of the land'... ...'this is a standing right under all conditions. Even if, at any point, the Jews choose to decline it, they have no right to deprive future generations of it. Our right to the entire land exists and stands for ever.


Ben Gurion confided privately, afterward, that he considered a partial Jewish State as only a beginning. He planned to organize a first-class army and then use coercion or force to settle in the rest of the country.


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"Renowned jurists throughout the world were ashamed of the Nuremberg proceedings. Certainly, Judge Robert H. Jackson, the American president of the accusers, was ashamed of these proceedings ; this was obvious from his "personal diary", which I have read."


"I have had the privilege of having access to the "Memoirs" (of Judge Jackson) at the Library of Congress...Shortly after Robert H. Jackson was entrusted by President Truman with the task of leading the American judges at the Nuremberg Trial, he found out about American plans to use atomic bombs; he was uneasy about the task entrusted to him : to pursue in the name of a nation, acts which it had itself committed, for he was aware that the United States was going to commit an even greater crime."


Referring to the book by Alpheus Thomas Mason on Harlan Fiske Stone: "Pillar of the Law" (Harlan Fiske Stone was Chief Justice of the Supreme Court of the United States) the lawyer Christie quoted page 715 of this book, in which Stone wrote to the editor of "Fortune" magazine that not only did he disown such a procedure, but that he regarded the whole thing as "a high-grade lynching party in Nuremberg."


No doubt, the other "witnesses" were simply tailoring their testimony to suit the wishes of prosecutors. The prosecutors were not merely trying to gain a few more convictions but had a broad, educational purpose which was to build a solid basis for their gassing theory so as to criminalize the Nazis and Germans forever and ever. Since they had no forensic evidence or documents for such gassings, the courtroom "testimony" of "eyewitnesses" was everything.


This is another case of the deniers distortion. Just because a couple of judges expressed negative opinions about the Nuremberg proceedings then the whole process and everything to do with it has to be disregarded as unreliable. What a load of rubbish. And it also contains lies. The Atom bombs were the most closely guarded secret the allies possessed, so how would a judge, totally unconnected with the Manhattan Project know anything about the bombs before they were dropped? And anyway, how could the dropping of the atom bombs, which killed, between them, less than 1/2 million be "...an even greater crime." than the deliberate murder of 6 million?


The most that the above opinions could be expected to mean is that some of the legal authorities involved in the Nuremberg trials were of the opinion that certain of the allies actions and the perpetrators of those actions should have been in the dock along with the Nazi's, and even this is a contentious issue


For instance, the area bombing of German and Japanese cities has often been referred to as a war crime. In the case of Germany though this is clearly nonsense. If the bombing had not occurred then there is a good chance that we would have lost the war against Germany. Leaving aside the damage caused to the German war effort due to disruption and loss of production, the bombing of Germany forced the Nazi's to keep 100,000 guns, 1,000,000 men and 75% of the Luftwaffe in Germany for defence. If these forces had been freed up to participate in the war against the USSR then there is a good chance that Germany might have won the war in the East in 1943 or '44 freeing up the entire Werhmacht to face the D-Day landings in June '44.


The case for the bombing of Japan is a little less clear cut, but even here, and even including the atom bombs, there is a good case that the course taken by the allies was the least expensive option in terms of human life both Allied and Japanese. After the battle of Okinawa and the horrendous loss of life, especially civilian, involved:

the Japanese lost over 100,000 troops, and the Allies (mostly United States) suffered more than 50,000 casualties, with over 12,000 killed in action. Hundreds of thousands of civilians were killed, wounded or attempted suicide. Approximately one-fourth of the civilian population died due to the invasion.

If the same pattern of casualties had been sustained during a land invasion of the Japanese home islands, the civilian casualties would have been counted in the 10's of millions and the war would have dragged on for years longer than it did.


So, as you can see, the area bombing of Germany and Japan were legitimate and necessary acts of war whereas the Holocaust was a deliberate act of mass murder which served no conceivable war aim of the Germans and, by depriving the German economy of vital manpower in the later stages of the war, actually harmed the Nazi war effort.


That is what is different about the Holocaust and why it is a crime unique in human history.

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Did six million people really visit the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum since it opened in April 1993?


That's what the United States Holocaust Memorial Council would have you believe, and if all you've been exposed to is its Zionist propaganda, you probably do. But just how many people have actually passed through the Holocaust Museum's doors?


Despite the wealth of evidence proving that the museum's visitor numbers are wildly exaggerated, it is truth seekers like myself who are labeled dangerous to society. Swayed by the Jewish agenda and its powerful lobby in Washington, millions of people have been duped into blindly accepting the museum's one-sided view of its attendance history. And those who attempt to set the record straight are promptly dismissed as "kooks," "liars," and, of course, "anti-Semites."


What are you afraid of, United States Holocaust Memorial Council? That the world will find out that the number of people interested in your museum has been greatly distorted?


Let's take a look at this supposedly well-visited museum. Just where do these attendance figures come from? You might be surprised by the answer: Speaking anonymously for fear of retribution, numerous Holocaust Museum workers have admitted that the six-million figure is "only an estimate." Furthermore, this misrepresentation includes not only visitors to the museum's Permanent Exhibition, which requires a pass, but also visitors to the rotating exhibits at the front of the building! Shocked? Anyone with a basic understanding of the way the Zionist propaganda machine works shouldn't be.


So, the supposed six million is not derived from the number of free tickets which have been distributed, but is instead a CAREFULLY AND DELIBERATELY MANIPULATED FIGURE which includes visitors to the museum who were unable to obtain a pass and only visited the all-access Wexler Learning Center. In other words, it includes visitors who could not in any way, shape, or form be counted! Even Sharon E. Underwood, one of the museum's own tour guides, admits that the question of how many people actually visited the museum remains "OPEN TO DEBATE." Yet the American Jewry continues to present six million as reality.


Further, while high-ranking Jews at the Holocaust Museum claim to have records showing the exact number of tickets distributed each day since its opening, none can provide ANY PROOF WHATSOEVER that once a ticket was handed out, the recipient actually used it and entered the museum!


Then there is the fact that a "computer glitch" wiped out all ticket data from May 14 to May 22, 1998. That begs the question, just how reliable are these computers that supposedly contain the museum's visitation records? And is it just a coincidence that those providing the six-million figure have clearly established ties to the museum's board of directors? It seems their "facts" are closer to the dangerous lie the museum and its sympathizers have so successfully gotten the public to buy into.


In addition, there is the issue of what can supposedly be found inside the museum, reported by visitors and accepted as truth by so many. How much of this is elaboration for the sake of currying the favor of the Horowitzes and Greenspans of this world? Why is flash photography EXPRESSLY PROHIBITED in the Hall Of Remembrance? WHAT ARE THEY TRYING TO HIDE? And what about that rumored museum gift shop, which supposedly offers Holocaust-related books, videotapes, and teaching materials? There is precious little evidence that it even exists, yet people around the world BLINDLY ACCEPT the trumped-up stories and believe that it is there, somewhere inside the museum.


Some will provide so-called "proof" of widespread interest in the museum in the form of newspaper clippings about its 1993 grand-opening ceremony. In one such article, which ran in THE JEW YORK TIMES, a journalist named DANIEL LEVINE wrote that 3,000 people attended. By studying the accompanying photograph, I was able to verify the presence of only 16 people. If this sort of skewed math, a fact-to-fiction ratio of 16:3,000, is applied to the alleged museum total of six million, the figure is reduced to 32,000.


Considering the Holocaust Museum's proximity to Washington's National Mall, it is plausible that 32,000 people have entered since 1993–even if most did so only to use the bathroom or get a drink of water. But compared to the millions of people who visit the Smithsonian or the National Air & Space Museum each year, can anyone consider the Holocaust Museum's measly 4,500 annual visitors significant? Hardly. It's time the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum closed the door on its lies once and for all.




as KOYTWATSI would say

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According to Rudolf Höß, commandant of Auschwitz, bunker 1 held 800 people, and bunker 2 held 1,200.[174] Once the chamber was full, the doors were screwed shut and solid pellets of Zyklon-B were dropped into the chambers through vents in the side walls, releasing toxic HCN, or hydrogen cyanide

Try again, Koy. :roll:

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Some more from Mr Höß, commandant of Auschwitz.

Another improvement we made over Treblinka was that we built our gas chambers to accommodate 2,000 people at one time, whereas at Treblinka their 10 gas chambers only accommodated 200 people each. The way we selected our victims was as follows: we had two SS doctors on duty at Auschwitz to examine the incoming transports of prisoners. The prisoners would be marched by one of the doctors who would make spot decisions as they walked by. Those who were fit for work were sent into the Camp. Others were sent immediately to the extermination plants. Children of tender years were invariably exterminated, since by reason of their youth they were unable to work. Still another improvement we made over Treblinka was that at Treblinka the victims almost always knew that they were to be exterminated and at Auschwitz we endeavored to fool the victims into thinking that they were to go through a delousing process. Of course, frequently they realized our true intentions and we sometimes had riots and difficulties due to that fact. Very frequently women would hide their children under the clothes but of course when we found them we would send the children in to be exterminated. We were required to carry out these exterminations in secrecy but of course the foul and nauseating stench from the continuous burning of bodies permeated the entire area and all of the people living in the surrounding communities knew that exterminations were going on at Auschwitz.


– Rudolf Höß, Auschwitz camp commandant, Nuremberg testimony.

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1. You agree, through your use of the Shetlink website, that you will not submit (or hyperlink to) any material or use language which is defamatory, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, inciting of violence, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or in violation of ANY UK law. Personal attacks, inflammatory language, harassment, impersonation and trolling will not be tolerated.

there was this little man who developed an irrational hatred of a ethnic minority he shouted that he was preaching the truth and he lead is country to its destruction. lks like we have a new leader in shetland.


perhaps he needs to start growing his tash and walking funny.



We need not waste time or effort answering the deniers' contentions. It would be never-ending to respond to arguments posed by those who freely falsify findings, quote out of context and simply dismiss reams of testimony. Unlike true scholars, they have little, if any, respect for data or evidence. Their commitment is to an ideology and their 'findings' are shaped to support it.


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Holocaust denial

Holocaust revisionism as it is referred to by its supporters or Holocaust denial as referred by its opposes, is the belief that the Holocaust did not occur as it is described by mainstream historiography.


Key elements of this belief are the explicit or implicit rejection that, in the Holocaust:



The Nazi government had a policy of deliberately targeting the Jews and the Gypsies for extermination as a people;




Over five million Jews were systematically killed by the Nazis and their allies.



Tools of efficient mass extermination, such as gas chambers, were used in extermination camps to kill Jews.



In addition, most Holocaust denial implies, or openly states, that the current mainstream understanding of the Holocaust is the result of a deliberate Jewish conspiracy created to advance the interest of Jews at the expense of other nations. For this reason, Holocaust denial is generally considered an antisemitic conspiracy theory. Because of this, Holocaust denial is also illegal in a number of European countries, as their governments hold that it is motivated by an antisemitic and anti-democratic agenda.


Most historians and scholars reject Holocaust denial as "grounded in hatred, rather than any accepted standards of assertion, evidence, and truth" and a "pseudoscience" that "rejects the entire foundation of historical evidence," instead motivated by an anti-semitic ideology.


While a few Holocaust deniers have training as historians, some of their most prominent representatives have been shown in court to have a pattern of falsifying historical documents (e.g. David Irving) or deliberately misrepresenting historical data (e.g. Ernst Zündel). This history of Holocaust deniers distorting, ignoring, or misusing historical records has led to almost universal condemnation of the techniques and conclusions of Holocaust denial, with organizations such as the American Historical Association, the largest society of historians in the United States, stating that Holocaust denial is "at best, a form of academic fraud."




Beliefs of Holocaust Deniers


Holocaust deniers make the following claims, though not all Holocaust deniers make all of the claims listed:


• Nazis did not use gas chambers to mass murder Jews. Small chambers did exist for delousing and Zyklon-B was used in this process.


• Nazis did not use cremation ovens to dispose of extermination victims. The amount of energy required to fire the ovens far exceeded what the energy-strapped nation could spare in wartime.


• The cremation ovens that existed would have been too small for this purpose and the reason there were cremation ovens at all was they were put in to provide cremation services for the deaths from natural causes and disease epidemics that could reasonably be expected in a high-density work camp.


• The figure of 5-6 million Jewish deaths is an irresponsible exaggeration, and many Jews who actually emigrated to Russia, Britain, Palestine and the United States are included in the number.


• Many photos and much of the film footage shown after World War II was specially manufactured as propaganda against the Nazis by the Allied forces. For example, one film, shown to Germans after the war, of supposed Holocaust victims were in fact German civilians being treated after Allied bombing of Dresden. Pictures we commonly see show victims of starvation or typhus, not of gassing.


• Claims of what the Nazis supposedly did to the Jews were all intended to facilitate the Allies in their intention to enable the creation of a Jewish homeland in Palestine, and are currently used to garner support for the policies of the state of Israel, especially in its dealings with the Palestinians.


• Historical proof for the Holocaust is falsified or deliberately misinterpreted.


• There is an American, British or Jewish conspiracy to make Jews look like victims and to demonize Germans. Also, it was in the Soviet interest to propagate wild stories about Germany in order to frighten related nations into accepting Soviet rule (Poland, Czechoslovakia, etc.). The amount of money pumped into Israel and reparations from Germany alone give Israel a strong incentive to maintain this conspiracy.


• The overwhelming number of biased academics and historians are too afraid to actually admit that the Holocaust was a fiction; they know they will lose their jobs if they speak up.


how did they die

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Guest Anonymous

where are the moderaters on this thread ?.. , it seems to be way of track with arguments about whether the holocaust happened or not , its supposed to be about modern day israel and the relationship of them with the rest of that region ( arab / muslim middle east ) .

Lots of very bad things happenec in world war two and your not going to win any argument there .

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lks like we have a new leader


Do you get the telly tubbies to write out your posts or something.


Death Dealer: The Memoirs of the SS Kommandant at Auschwitz, by Rudolf Höss. Steven Paskuly, ed., Andrew Pollinger, trans., with a foreward by Primo Levi.

Da Capo Press, New York. 1996. Softcover. 390 pages. Notes. $15.95.


(*** Mod - clipped; quote far too long. Please provide a link to the source material instead. ***)


Höß' writings are important documents on the history of the Holocaust. It is unfortunate that the editors of this particular volume refused to give this material a more objective presentation. As with most exterminationist productions, the volume is flawed by the editor's imposition of his pre-established beliefs and personal convictions. An objective academic-style analysis of the complete writings and testimony of Rudolph Höß has yet to be compiled. Death Dealer could have, and should have been this volume, instead it is merely another attempt to support a monolithic statue whose feet are made of clay.


They were lying, they are lying, they will be lying.

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answer the question

how did they die

this lady was run over by a bus



this man was just misunderstood


the people are of course actors in the pay of the zionists.


welcome to butlins



we have lots of locations


of course non of this happened. they all lied the nazis were just nice friendly people



if you really belive what your saying your one sick person. and yes we are watching you.


(*** Mod - Images unlinked due to size and hot-linking concerns; please follow the links for the original images ***)

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(*** Mod - Personal comments removed ***)


The Jewish Hoax:

Do the Jews Really Exist?

by Secret Jew Ted Shoemaker


Are you under the delusion that Jews exist? That is a common misconception fostered by vicious liars.







Some will argue that Jews exist on the basis of historical records. Such records do in fact go back thousands of years. Now ask yourself: who wrote most of these records? The Jews themselves! Of course you can't believe them when they tell you they exist! They obviously have some unscrupulous interest in convincing you of their existence. What else could account for it?





"Just look at the Jewish way of life", someone proposes. Bah! This argument is clearly a red herring. We are not concerned about the Jewish way of life; we are looking for Jewish people. The existence of the former is a separate question from the existence of the latter!





Some untrustworthy witnesses claim to have seen, spoken with, or even been married to Jewish people. We have only to ask, How much did the Great Jewish Conspiracy pay them to say this? It must be understood, a person who makes an outrageous statement like this is no different from one who claims to hear the voices of loved ones from thousands of miles away (See: Telephone Hoax).





It is reported that a small percentage of Jewish people actually claim to exist. This is, by far, the cleverest and most insidious lie of anything in the repertoire of the Jewish Conspiracy. Of course they claim to exist! What else did you expect?



A PROOF THAT JEWS DON'T EXIST: Kosher hot dogs. You can't live on that stuff.


THEREFORE, the real reason the Holocaust didn't happen is that JEWS DON'T EXIST!!

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