Colin Posted February 10, 2014 Report Share Posted February 10, 2014 So, if they are not, why do you need a firearms certificate? Do you really understand the issue? I gave you the reason they are 'required' but, I do not know why they are 'needed'.(apart from the usual conspiracy theories) Ask the people who framed the legislation. Whilst you are at it, ask them why a Shotgun does not need a firearms certificate. gafynandrew 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redrobbie Posted February 10, 2014 Report Share Posted February 10, 2014 (edited) Another of the SNP proposal's that concern's me is compensation or should i say the lack of it.The SNP are proposing that anyone who fall's foul of their retrospective catch 22 new laws and are unable to get a air gun certificate will be required to hand in their previously legally owned private property for no compensation whatsoever .They also state that the average price of a new air gun is around £100.Even a coursery glance through the advertising section of any air gun magazine will show this figure to be a joke. Edited February 10, 2014 by redrobbie gafynandrew 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redrobbie Posted February 10, 2014 Report Share Posted February 10, 2014 Right to property .http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_to_property Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redrobbie Posted February 10, 2014 Report Share Posted February 10, 2014 (edited) They paid out in this case .http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/286603.stm Edited February 10, 2014 by redrobbie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redrobbie Posted February 10, 2014 Report Share Posted February 10, 2014 Some interesting facts on this site. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_the_United_Kingdom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shetlandpeat Posted February 10, 2014 Report Share Posted February 10, 2014 So, if they are not, why do you need a firearms certificate? Do you really understand the issue? I gave you the reason they are 'required' but, I do not know why they are 'needed'.(apart from the usual conspiracy theories) Ask the people who framed the legislation. Whilst you are at it, ask them why a Shotgun does not need a firearms certificate. So, you do not know except for a theory. Whilst you are at it, ask them why a Shotgun does not need a firearms certificate.Cos it is a Shotgun, they have their own license. The answer there is quite obvious. But really, it is not the issue. You need a Firearms license for an airgun, it then categorises said airgun in the firearms section of the licensing system under the Firearms Acts. The real reason, which again is so obvious is that shotguns are smooth bore and hold up to 2 rounds, a "Firearm", within the definition of the Firearms Acts, means a lethal barrelled weapon of any description, from which any shot, bullet or other missile can be discharged. A section 1 shotgun is a semi-automatic shotgun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted February 10, 2014 Report Share Posted February 10, 2014 "Cos it is a Shotgun, they have their own license. The answer there is quite obvious." No it isn't. A shotgun, by definition, is a firearm as it uses an explosive propellant. "You need a Firearms license for an airgun, it then categorises said airgun in the firearms section of the licensing system under the Firearms Acts." You only need a FAC if the muzzle velocity exceeds a set maximum and, as far as I can see, the need to then classify it as a firearm is nothing more than a 'convenience' it is, however, still by definition an air weapon and NOT a firearm. "The real reason, which again is so obvious is that shotguns are smooth bore and hold up to 2 rounds, a "Firearm", within the definition of the Firearms Acts, means a lethal barrelled weapon of any description, from which any shot, bullet or other missile can be discharged. A section 1 shotgun is a semi-automatic shotgun." Oh dear!! Proof indeed that you do not understand the argument. I have never seen a shotgun with a rifled barrel but, I have seen smooth bore rifles and pistols and I have also seen shotguns that hold more than 2 rounds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shetlandpeat Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 Sadly, grasping at straws. All the definitions are contained within the Acts, of which are freely available. Colin, they will also explain your other questions and observations you raise. Pump action shotguns have their own class, these hold more than 2 rounds, smooth bore guns can still fall into firearms categories. Shotguns have a separate license because they are smooth bored and do not hold more than 2 rounds, unless a class 1 shotgun which can be described as semi automatic.. The fact that a fire arm is a weapon with a rifled barrel, is why airguns are classed the same, there is no definition on propulsion. There is an exemption on the license requirements of certain airguns, but, they are still FIREARMS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorrie Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 There's two issues being blurred into one here. Legal terminology and certification. You can be done for possession of a firearm in a public place without good cause (IIRC) even if the gun in question is a sub 12ft lbs air rifle. I'm pretty sure all weapons are lumped into the 'firearm' category as far as the courts are concerned. That's why reference is always made to 'brandishing/discharging a firearm' in court reports when some ned starts being an ass with an air pistol/rifle. So an air rifle doesn't necessarily need a 'firearms' certificate - but can still be called a firearm in court. Technically an incorrect statement, but the courts still do it. Certification: Sub 12ft lb air rifle (or 6ft lb for air pistol) rifled or unrifled barrel: None required. Smoothbore weapon using an explosive propellant (this includes blackpowder weapons): Shotgun certificate (plus relevant black powder certificates for BP weapons). FAC for everything else...and don't even bother asking for a FAC for a handgun unless it's a single shot target pistol.... I'm a bit rusty and out of date with this as I haven't shot for some time, but I'm sure the above info is still correct. However........... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redrobbie Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 http://www.tartansauthority.com/tartan/the-growth-of-tartan/the-act-of-proscription-1747/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorrie Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 So...... ...the English banned airguns after Culloden? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gafynandrew Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 Sadly, grasping at straws. All the definitions are contained within the Acts, of which are freely available. Colin, they will also explain your other questions and observations you raise. Pump action shotguns have their own class, these hold more than 2 rounds, smooth bore guns can still fall into firearms categories. Shotguns have a separate license because they are smooth bored and do not hold more than 2 rounds, unless a class 1 shotgun which can be described as semi automatic.. The fact that a fire arm is a weapon with a rifled barrel, is why airguns are classed the same, there is no definition on propulsion. There is an exemption on the license requirements of certain airguns, but, they are still FIREARMS! The short and sweet version of the law is that air rifles and air pistols are both classed as air weapons unless they're over the legal power limit. 12ft/lbs for air rifles and 6ft/lbs for air pistols. If your air weapon is over the said power levels then you require a firearms certificate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gafynandrew Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 So...... ...the English banned airguns after Culloden? The first ever true sniper rifles were air rifles, they were used in the American war of independence. That's how the story of the 'Minutemen' began. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redrobbie Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 (edited) So...... ...the English banned airguns after Culloden? The SNP are on record as saying they want control over all gun legislation as soon as possible so they can''modernise'' it. I think we all know what that means.When i included the link referring to the disarmament acts which were imposed on the people of Scotland i was trying to highlight the irony of the SNP's present stated position on these issues in a historical context. As a matter of interest kilt's and bagpipes were also banned under the same act's something that raisers the ire of Scottish nationalist's to this day. Edited February 11, 2014 by redrobbie gafynandrew 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redrobbie Posted February 11, 2014 Report Share Posted February 11, 2014 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/personal-view/3642290/SNPs-concern-with-gun-law-is-opportunistic.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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