How to deal with Neddish behaviour?

[Marjolein]

Sounds like they should call up Frank Watt to the force!

[The Man]

There is a twofold problem with this problem and the police. One, how many polis are working in Shetland at any one time? How many calls do they get and where do you want them to be? Down Commercial Street waiting for the weans to play up (which they won't do 'cos the polis ar there) or answering problem calls where there are crimes happening? The other part of the problem is this wee thing called human righst/civil liberties that a lot of fowk on this site are fond of spouting off about. Polis are only allowed to act when a crime or offense has been comitted. Unless Tony changed the law (again) without telling us. That means these weans have rights too and can stand there all they want unless their causing a cfrime or offense. I dont like it much either but if they were yours and came home saying a polis slapped them upside the heid for standing about the street annoying fowk, i dunno about youse but i'd be straight up the station and chinning the man that did it!

 

Once agin, as so often before in this forum, its damed if you do, damned if you dont for the polis. But what about the bairns' parents? Why, if shetland isnt that big a place, cant you have a word with them and ask why they are letting their bairns intimidate or uposet old folk and parents of young bairns? It starts at home, altho it may end in the cells or court!!!

 

If shetland has a problems with these kids, it has a problem with their patrents too!!! 8O

[Muppet]

.................That means these weans have rights too and can stand there all they want unless their causing a cfrime or offense. I dont like it much either but if they were yours and came home saying a polis slapped them upside the heid for standing about the street annoying fowk, i dunno about youse but i'd be straight up the station and chinning the man that did it!

....................................................................................................................................................................If shetland has a problems with these kids, it has a problem with their patrents too!!! 8O

 

If their parents head up to the police station to 'chin the man that did it' then there certainly is a problem with their parents!

 

If a wean of mine got a dressing down from a policeman for annoying folk on the street, i'd want to know what the heck they were doing and i'd make damn sure they didn't get the chance to do it again!

[Njugle]

There is a twofold problem with this problem and the police. One, how many polis are working in Shetland at any one time? How many calls do they get and where do you want them to be? Down Commercial Street waiting for the weans to play up (which they won't do 'cos the polis ar there) or answering problem calls where there are crimes happening? The other part of the problem is this wee thing called human righst/civil liberties that a lot of fowk on this site are fond of spouting off about. Polis are only allowed to act when a crime or offense has been comitted. Unless Tony changed the law (again) without telling us. That means these weans have rights too and can stand there all they want unless their causing a cfrime or offense. I dont like it much either but if they were yours and came home saying a polis slapped them upside the heid for standing about the street annoying fowk, i dunno about youse but i'd be straight up the station and chinning the man that did it!

 

Once agin, as so often before in this forum, its damed if you do, damned if you dont for the polis. But what about the bairns' parents? Why, if shetland isnt that big a place, cant you have a word with them and ask why they are letting their bairns intimidate or uposet old folk and parents of young bairns? It starts at home, altho it may end in the cells or court!!!

 

If shetland has a problems with these kids, it has a problem with their patrents too!!! 8O

 

I agree with that, but the point about the bairns having the right to congregate doesn't sit all that well with me, as many was the time when i was a teen we would gather at the cross , drink beer and listen to tape recorders, enjoying the sunshine and causing devilment to no-one. More often than not a policeman or two would appear and "move us on", which usually meant to the fort, out of sight and mind of joe public. It was all very amicable, even perhaps a bit of a game.

[The Man]

Aye but that was in our day. These days the polis themselves hand out leaflets to bairns at school saying "Know your rights". SEriously its true. It may not have happened here yet but my nephew in Inverness got one printed upo by Northern Coinstabulary. It told them what they can and cant do and - more importantly for this issue - what Polis can and cant do. That included moving them on where they had no grounds for doing so, ie, no offence had been committed or no bylaw existed.

 

The "chinning" bit was in respojse to folks suggesting bobbies went back to the old days of smacking folk who annoyed them. Personally i think that day is well past and rightly so. Polis enforec the law, they are NOT the law (despite what some Dredd wannabbes may think).

 

[Ghostrider]

Down Commercial Street waiting for the weans to play up (which they won't do 'cos the polis ar there) or....

 

And right there is your answer. The Police don't need to do anything, they just need to be visible enough to put the thought in peoples minds that they are near enough, and paying enough attention that they are available to do, and will do, if necessary. It's called "deterrent value", just like the dummy speed cameras and dummy alarm boxes that get used. It worked perfectly well for a hell of a long time, it wasn't broke, so why did they "fix" it by pulling a significant number of the foot patrols in favour of sending out a squad car as and when they got a call? Seemed to me, back in the day when foot patrols were the norm along the street there was never a need to make a call and having a "special order" dispatched from the top of Market Street, the foot patrol had defused or prevented any potential situation before anyone found it alarming enough to call for help to restore the peace.

 

Fair enough, if the Police are already all occupied responding to actual calls, and there is no-one to send on patrol, that can't be helped. But, it can be fixed by demanding Dingwall, or Inverness, or wherever the big chief sits now, gives us more manpower. As if the number we have are as busy as that, we need more.

 

It's not so much a case of whether you see the Police doing foot patrols on the street or not, the very fact that that question arises proves my point as to how things have changed in 30 years. Ask anyone familiar with the street in the 70's, and they'll tell you you'd be lucky to have walked from Solotti's to the Fort chipper between 9 and 5, particularly between 2 and 5, and not met a Police foot patrol at some point.

 

Maybe folks are worse behaved and more disrespectful today than we were, but I'm yet to be convinced of that, but reinstating foot patrols on the street to at least mid 70's levels would go quite some way to proving that one way or the other.

[JustMe]

Ghostrider wrote

Fair enough, if the Police are already all occupied responding to actual calls, and there is no-one to send on patrol, that can't be helped. But, it can be fixed by demanding Dingwall, or Inverness, or wherever the big chief sits now, gives us more manpower. As if the number we have are as busy as that, we need more.

Maybe this is a population thing.......Shetland gets so many police hours a week based on the population. If so and the resources are being managed properly then perhaps there is a case to be made for extra resources over and above our "entitlement" as clearly there is disquiet about visible policing within Lerwick.

[Strawb]

This thread is full of people talking about the bad behaviour of young people, but this past Sunday I saw a man, who was certainly in his 8th decade, shouting abuse at random people walking past the Lerwick Legion. One boy in particular, who was wearing a hooded sweatshirt and aged about 16, was on the receiving end of some rather nasty language, just because he had his hood up. Now, as far as I could see, this boy was doing absolutely no harm, and even managed to keep a dignified silence in the face of this abuse and carried on walking. Personally speaking I would have let the old goat have it with both barrels!! But alas he chose not to shout at me. Could this guy qualify as Shetland's oldest ned?!?

[Ally]

Surely Auld Tammy doesn't count?

[The Man]

Still say its the parents. Kids learn at an early age whats acceptable and whats not. the old, "Give me the child..." line has a basis in psychology. Muck theuir heads up or get it wrong in their fornmative years and if you ever get them sorted, itll be a battle!

 

Also i tyhink our culture is werong when it comes to alchol and kids. friedns of mine in france give their kids wine at th table (in moderation and watered). Theres bno mystery or "mustnt touch" there and far less problem with it. Its the old forbidden fruit syndrome. Like controlled drugs, the more you say, 'stay away! Avoid! Dont touch! Dont talk about It!' the more their curiosity will make them think, 'why not/ what does it do and why can THEY have it but no us? tTHEY enjoy it, ity must be good"

 

Then you have the shetlanders (and you are out thyere, dont deny it) who either give their teenage kids drink for parties or turn a blind eye because thats what your parents did for you. I'm no gonna go there. Too volatile, but...

 

Having said all that alcohol is not teh only reason for all this alledged bother on the street. IOts down to kids just having no damn respect. Teh pack metality kicks in when theyre drinking or doing drugs (another oproven psychological factor) and they stop behaving like they normally would and go out to outdo each other and "prove" thesselves to each other.

 

Nyaffs.

[DarkstarIII]

Still say its the parents. Kids learn at an early age whats acceptable and whats not. the old, "Give me the child..." line has a basis in psychology. Muck theuir heads up or get it wrong in their fornmative years and if you ever get them sorted, itll be a battle!

 

Also i tyhink our culture is werong when it comes to alchol and kids. friedns of mine in france give their kids wine at th table (in moderation and watered). Theres bno mystery or "mustnt touch" there and far less problem with it. Its the old forbidden fruit syndrome. Like controlled drugs, the more you say, 'stay away! Avoid! Dont touch! Dont talk about It!' the more their curiosity will make them think, 'why not/ what does it do and why can THEY have it but no us? tTHEY enjoy it, ity must be good"

 

 

 

Nyaffs.

 

I agree.....

[Guest Anonymous]

I am making thuis post in a state of smouldering anger , just before christmas a young burra man was beaten , nearly to death on commercial street in lerwick. he was attacked so badly that his liver was ruptured and he is still in intensive care in aberdeen, as far as i know the people who carried out this murderous attack have not been traced, the only thing tom can remember is there were three of them , which is common of the methods these cowardly miserable excuse for human beings use.

Also i was scanning through bebo the other night and i came across the page of a young lerwick man who has already been convicted and done time for assaults of this nature and on his profile , he pointed out that he hates everybody from burra and scalloway and also anybody from anywhere in between there and lerwick!

the saddest thing about this problem is the fact that these people take pride in being ignorant in this way .

the young man who's life is still hanging in the balance was tom robertson he was kicked and jumped on so badly that his liver was ruptured.

is it alright to name and shame thes scum like the twat who has already been convicted and brags about his hatred on bebo?

personally i think thes ignorant useless bsterds should be rounded up and shot.

[JustMe]

Name and shame........not sure. Posting a link to a bebo site where someone has published information about themselves that might be relevant to a serious discussion about bad behaviour in Lerwick ought to be ok.

 

Scale it up a bit and it is no different to posting a link to some sort of newspaper which has published something controversial.

[crofter]

the saddest thing about this problem is the fact that these people take pride in being ignorant in this way .

 

is it alright to name and shame thes scum like the twat who has already been convicted and brags about his hatred on bebo?

 

I doubt if he would be ashamed. As you point out, there is something wrong with the way their brains work; they are subhuman sociopaths and would more likely enjoy the notoriety.

[Ally]

Not much to add, except to mainly concur with droilker. I'm afraid that I may sound like a bit of a rabid daily mail reader here, but as both a witness and a victim of this kind of unprovoked violence, I would argue that no amount of background reports, second chances etc that will inevitably occur when/if they catch these goons is gonna do much good to Tom, lying in hospital because certain folk think it's okay to kick a boy unconsciousness and perhaps one day beyond... I'm sorry, but these thugs are behaving like animals and we could perhaps do worse than to treat them as such...