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School closures


GAZ1888CELTIC
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Well said, hjasga. One problem with the schools 'debate', and indeed much debate in Shetland, is the spite and name-calling, rather than a serious discussion of the issues. This loses the anti-closers a lot of credibility and respect, but unfortunately it seems to get to the Councillors and push them into making non-decisions, or blaming Council officials. If I was the official in question, I'd have told them where to stick the job, years ago.

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Apologies for any offence caused

 

The cuts are unrealistic and will fail to deliver the childrens education if allowed to go ahead.

 

Many believe, SIC could end up with one of the biggest legal costs when the local community, parents, grand parents, children, employers fight back.

 

Plus the community can get grants for legal costs to fight against School closures.

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Well said, hjasga. One problem with the schools 'debate', and indeed much debate in Shetland, is the spite and name-calling, rather than a serious discussion of the issues.

Just as you are doing here, Stanley:

 

My, who'd be a Skerries bairn? Not only are the locals terrifying the wits out of them about the evils they will face going off-island, but now folk are coming across from Papa Stour to do it too.

 

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Baltasound is back in the closure mix again. I have a child with additional needs there. He will not be boarding in Lerwick.

So what do we do? Leave I guess or home educate. He has changed completely at Baltasound with the pressure of having to deal with lots of people taken away. His needs can not be met in a large school because it is a large school and even if kept in 'a unit' everyone is still there. Fortunately he should have left before closures take place. Out here in the Northern Isles he may find a job working with a few people and have a future. Dragged into a town he potentially faces a life of hell.

It would seem that the 'getting it right for every child' does not apply to those with additional needs who need something different to the one size fits all approach. Those like him -and worse -will need an escort from home to school and back again each week. They will need a lot of evening supervision in the hostel. Some will need all night supervision. Most can not share rooms. Where currently in small classes they cope with minimal extra help 1-1's will be needed in class. Where mum acts as homework scribe currently an evening scribe will need to be employed to do homework....the costs mount up. oh doing homework in a room with others wont work either as some can't cope. Then there is food with a child who does not like eating certain things and the autism problems of food touching on a plate... The closure of small schools that people have deliberately moved to be near because they met their childrens needs is going to cost a fortune in the long run. More than keeping schools open.

Oh and don't give me the rhetoric about cost because education closures is meant to be about education not cost. It is not possible to give a better education in a larger school because size is the problem...

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hi madmandy, you have highlighted one of the major issues with the relentless attempts to centralise education in Shetland.  Unfortunately, you won't get much sympathy on here. People who are not affected will be unable to empathise with you and at the end of the day they really don't care what happens to families living in the remote isles.

 

Previous comments I have made directed towards the head of the department driving these changes have been leapt upon, how dare you criticise the department or the person in charge. No one should be held responsible or accountable, god forbid you should ever voice your feelings or opinions on Shetlink, even though the same and worse is being said behind closed doors all over Shetland.

 

Is it okay for Catriona Waddington to call schools service a bunch of liars (if Baltasound is now put forward for closure) in the Shetland Times because she used NICE language?  I'll have to remember that one.

Edited by trowie246
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I see the Skerries closure meeting is delayed because the first survey was not 100% accurate.

Why should the Skerries folk have todo yet another survey that may be tampered. Send your views to Helen Budge or her email, yes that is a real incentive to share your views.

 

The first lot of figures being published looked false. 101%?

 

Skerries should be able to share their views knowing they will be heard and counted. This is about their school, community and all the long term causes and effect.

 

Bottom line is they have genuine concerns that their views are not heard or counted. 

 

Can Skerries community trust sending their views to Helen Budge? 

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I see the Skerries closure meeting is delayed because the first survey was not 100% accurate.

Why should the Skerries folk have todo yet another survey that may be tampered. Send your views to Helen Budge or her email, yes that is a real incentive to share your views.

 

The first lot of figures being published looked false. 101%?

 

Skerries should be able to share their views knowing they will be heard and counted. This is about their school, community and all the long term causes and effect.

 

Bottom line is they have genuine concerns that their views are not heard or counted. 

 

Can Skerries community trust sending their views to Helen Budge? 

 

Listening to the parties on Radio Shetland ... A error has occurred and it has been acknowlwdged, hence more time given.

Would you rather the proceedings continued with the known error ? Thereby leaving the door open to a Legal Challenge ?

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hi madmandy, you have highlighted one of the major issues with the relentless attempts to centralise education in Shetland.  Unfortunately, you won't get much sympathy on here. People who are not affected will be unable to empathise with you and at the end of the day they really don't care what happens to families living in the remote isles.

 

Previous comments I have made directed towards the head of the department driving these changes have been leapt upon, how dare you criticise the department or the person in charge. No one should be held responsible or accountable, god forbid you should ever voice your feelings or opinions on Shetlink, even though the same and worse is being said behind closed doors all over Shetland.

 

Is it okay for Catriona Waddington to call schools service a bunch of liars (if Baltasound is now put forward for closure) in the Shetland Times because she used NICE language?  I'll have to remember that one.

 

You can criticise the actions of the department all you like, but once you start singling out individuals - even those most senior - and questioning their integrity, I think you have to take a step back and realise you might be getting a little too personal. At the end of the day these are still people, and I don't believe anybody could genuinely suggest they're not trying to do what they think is best.

 

I haven't seen the comments from the individual you mention, you seem to be in debate with yourself on that one.

 

I see the Skerries closure meeting is delayed because the first survey was not 100% accurate.

Why should the Skerries folk have todo yet another survey that may be tampered. Send your views to Helen Budge or her email, yes that is a real incentive to share your views.

 

The first lot of figures being published looked false. 101%?

 

Skerries should be able to share their views knowing they will be heard and counted. This is about their school, community and all the long term causes and effect.

 

Bottom line is they have genuine concerns that their views are not heard or counted. 

 

Can Skerries community trust sending their views to Helen Budge? 

 

What nonsense. There was a technical error and as soon as it was brought to attention they postponed the decision to give more time to investigate.

 

Not sure what your 101% refers to, most likely in a professional report figures are simply rounded.

Edited by hjasga
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Hi Trowie- I am not aware of catrionas comment however if that is what she said she will have measured her words and chosen them carefully.

Perhaps -a radical thought what is needed here is for the three Northern Isles and other remote islands to have a budget for their needs be it education or roads and decide for themselves what services they deem relevant to them. Thus if they were given their allocation of the education budget it would be up to each to decide who what where and how. I believe that would be decentralisation and so could never happen.

instead of building a new Anderson why don't all the children travel to Aberdeen every week on Sunday night arriving in time for school on Monday??? Think of all the money saved. Don't like that idea? No well from up here in the North it seem reasonable. Just think Lerwick children would be on one ferry instead of two ferries and several busses. They would be with their peers in a herd learning important life skills...

In fact the more I think about it the better it sounds. All children over 11 to Aberdeen all week- for the good of their future- and the current school used as a giant primary boarding department. Instead of learning about oh crofting at home they can do it as a lesson.

Lerwick is considered a remote outpost by mainland Scotland so don't think that this could not happen.

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Baltasound is back in the closure mix again. I have a child with additional needs there. He will not be boarding in Lerwick.

So what do we do? Leave I guess or home educate. He has changed completely at Baltasound with the pressure of having to deal with lots of people taken away. His needs can not be met in a large school because it is a large school and even if kept in 'a unit' everyone is still there. Fortunately he should have left before closures take place. Out here in the Northern Isles he may find a job working with a few people and have a future. Dragged into a town he potentially faces a life of hell.

It would seem that the 'getting it right for every child' does not apply to those with additional needs who need something different to the one size fits all approach. Those like him -and worse -will need an escort from home to school and back again each week. They will need a lot of evening supervision in the hostel. Some will need all night supervision. Most can not share rooms. Where currently in small classes they cope with minimal extra help 1-1's will be needed in class. Where mum acts as homework scribe currently an evening scribe will need to be employed to do homework....the costs mount up. oh doing homework in a room with others wont work either as some can't cope. Then there is food with a child who does not like eating certain things and the autism problems of food touching on a plate... The closure of small schools that people have deliberately moved to be near because they met their childrens needs is going to cost a fortune in the long run. More than keeping schools open.

Oh and don't give me the rhetoric about cost because education closures is meant to be about education not cost. It is not possible to give a better education in a larger school because size is the problem...

 There is so much wrong with this attitude.  "The world owes me special treatment".  It is also willful blindness.  When they dont close some of the schools some of the savings they would have made will have to come from elsewhere including what's left of the asn budget.  Your own child is going to suffer more than others becuase people are more interested in the location of their kids education than the quality of their kids education.  "...schools that people have deliberately moved to be near because they met their childrens needs..."  Those schools wont meet those needs anymore when theres no asn budget.  No asn teachers outside lerwick, no classroom assistants, no individual school meals for pupils with autism etc.  Anyone who needs help wont get it because the money will be spent on buildings not people.  "It would seem that the 'getting it right for every child' does not apply to those with additional needs who need something different to the one size fits all approach."  Agreed.  But thats because most parents aren't interested in asn so they are happy to sacrifice asn to keep unsustainable remote schools open.  Their kids might be fine but anyone with asn will suffer from this.

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Many of the Rural community in Shetland are not only remote, but fragile and vulnerable,many know how expensive living in the remoter Islands, never mind children being educated in the same age group.( this does not improve their education)

 

One of the many biggest damage to a childs education is poverty.

 

If the SIC cause poverty to the fragile community of the children,and especially the childs parents, grand parents etc this will be one of the biggest negative effects on the childrens education. A background of poverty effects a childs education more than being in the same age group.

 

I believe closing a School like Skerries, Unst,Yell,or Whalsey,  would effect the economics of these beautiful Islands as per the various socio economic reports indicate.

 

I give you these research links that back these poverty findings

 http://www.esrc.ac.uk/news-and-events/features-casestudies/features/15263/The_gap_years_education_and_social_immobility.aspx

 

End of the day we do not want these Islands ending up like St Kilda, or Papa Stour?

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I think it is more the Government that causes the poverty. Also, the other stats that are available on line show Shetland to have the highest AVERAGE wage and the local authority that has a huge sum of money to spend. It would be difficult to convince the Gov that Islands woul become protected nature reserves instead of housing a few folk (in the bigger picture).

Your children are however your responsibility, if you think that the state education is not good enough, either campaign directly to improve, or take other measures. It would of course be very easy to blame others.

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I don't think I am 'owed anything'   however if laws are in place to give certain education etc I expect them to apply to my child in a remote area same as a child in a town.  How would you feel if you were burgled and told, sorry because you live out there we don't investigate it.  The law of the land has given children certain educational rights. These apply regardless of geographical location.  No ASN teachers outside Lerwick???? sorry not legal.  Bobby check the law.

Yes if I don't like the system I can home educate, well yes and no. The laws on home education are different in Scotland to England as I am sure you all know Shetland Pete. I have home educated in England.  And just how apart from writing letters and attending meetings do I change anything? I stick to my earlier suggestion that having closed all schools eventually schools in Lerwick will close too. Don't be complacent because you live in a town called Lerwick- there are council estates in UK with bigger populations.

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