How to prevent pain and ignore illnesses in the NHS

[paulb]

you maybe correct. sorry if confused. not difficult for me. please note im not defending any poor treatment. just its not always straight forward as it first seems. 

[bresail]

I am beginning to think that some of these posts are spoof.

If a doctor sends a patient for an x-ray or what he thinks is an emergency and a nurse/ triage over rules him then why have doctors surgeries.

Meanings of words, 

 Accident -  an unforeseen and unwanted injury, not reliant on a specific day.

Emergency -  an accident that has occurred, which if not treated can become worse further putting the injured person, who has or should have become a patient, at further risk. This is also not day or date reliant.

Broken or suspected break - A non definate state, a slightly broken rib is possible but so is a broken edged bone which when it is pressed to check for injury stabs through the lung.

As for Shetland not being able to provide adequate hospital cover for it's residents of 22.000 persons.

Vestmannaeyjer in Island has a population of 4,000, has a hospital, retirement home and apartments for the elderly, several nursery schools, two elementary schools and one secondary school.

The hospital is open 365 and a quarter days a year.                   

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

she would have been seen. radiographer are always on-call they don't just tell folks to leave. ive been diverted to the walk in doctor once if i was south i would have been kept in did i mind no why because we cant be the same as a large town hospital. 6 weeks ago my doctor refereed me to a&e with chest pains. the care was excellent and just as fast and thorugh as any where. i was xrayed and received loads of tests. i was admitted to ward 3 and was set to wait over the weekend. i cant cope in strange places so i bullied the doctor to allow me home but to report each day. i took my chances and ignored the best advice. i was lucky. so if your seriously ill or potentially you will be seen and treated and if needed xrayed and scanned. but if its not urgent please dont expect to receive urgent care outside hours. if you want more folks on duty you will need to pay more. its not just a&e those radiographers need to rest. would you want an exhausted person to see you. they will come in cheerfully if needed but not for minor injuries. brian you should know that as trade union rep people just cant be on duty 24/7.  remember you need to be fit for your normal shift afterwards.    

 

I'm sure the doctor really appreciated being bullied when you could have just discharged yourself.

 

Honestly, these people get paid to be on call.  Hospitals have to have staff on call because if not, the A&E Unit would be closed.  It wasn't closed.  We don't even know if the 'facts' as presented in the newspaper story are true.

 

A few years ago in Shetland I had a fall.  There was no x-ray bod on duty and I was told they would be there in about an hour.  Suspected chipped bone in foot/ankle.  Not life threatening but hey, got to check, right?  So they called the on call member of staff who drove in.

 

About 12 years ago in London I sat in Whipps Cross A&E from 2pm until 3am with torn ligaments.  After an x-ray I was told to come back at 8.00am when I would be seen by Orthopaedics Team who don't work through the night.

 

In the month or so before I moved up to Shetland, I broke my ankle.  I'd walked on it for three days and hobbled up 42 steps each day.  Again, Whipps Cross A&E.  Put in plaster same night but told to make own way home and if need be, to "shuffle up the stairs on your bottom".  Had to return a week later and GP organised ambulance.

 

We already pay for healthcare through NI contributions.  If I was the one who had been told no x-ray available, then I would have asked to speak to the hospital duty manager.

[paulb]

i did not want to spend the weekend in a hospital bed waiting for monday. my condition was stable and controlled by meds. i convinced the consultant that to allow me to be at home. i maybe dumb but even i would not discharge my self  with an active cardiac problem. simply put i cant cope with public space for more than a brief limited time. i knew the risks and i took them.   

 

a gp is often over ruled by a hospital doctor/nurse. they have the correct skill set to judge a persons condition. 

Honestly, these people get paid to be on call.

 

 

 

  try it day after day and you may decide its not wise to always call someone in. as you discovered if the clinician decides you need it you will be xrayed. the issue here is was the patient care correct if it was were is the story. the nurse obviously mismanaged informing the patient.

We already pay for healthcare through NI contributions.  If I was the one who had been told no x-ray available, then I would have asked to speak to the hospital duty manager.

 

 so you believe in shouting it still does not mean you need an xray then and there. if you believe £2.75 pays for your care you clearly living in the past. http://www.sdhct.nhs.uk/uploads/23968.pdfis a very rou gh idea of costs. even if you went to the duty manager if the clinicians judgement is correct  you would still be waiting. none knows the real story here. odds are its somewhere in between the papers story and what the hospital said. lastly a minor brake will show better after a day or two its why your re xrayed if you attend the fracture clinic. if it was a mistake then the doctor/nurse will need to learn from it. but even with the best equipment brakes can be missed.    

[Scorrie]

 

"..... none knows the real story here. odds are its somewhere in between the papers story and what the hospital said..... "

 

At last, took some getting there, but some people are getting it......  

Edited October 20, 2015 by Scorrie

[fionajohn]

why can't the all the staff work a 5 out of 7 days a week?years ago i was in the ambulance service and our hours were changed to this system a slight rise in pay(could be paid for with the withdrawal of on call money)weekends are just another working day no need for time or double time.

bonus of this system is that people could get a routine x ray appointment for these days ensuring that the staff have a workload the same as they do monday-friday

[MuckleJoannie]

The hospital should let us know when they are having public hoidays,then we will know to stay in our beds, just in case    

Remember most accidents happen in the home!

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

i did not want to spend the weekend in a hospital bed waiting for monday. my condition was stable and controlled by meds. i convinced the consultant that to allow me to be at home. i maybe dumb but even i would not discharge my self  with an active cardiac problem. simply put i cant cope with public space for more than a brief limited time. i knew the risks and i took them.   

 

a gp is often over ruled by a hospital doctor/nurse. they have the correct skill set to judge a persons condition. 

Honestly, these people get paid to be on call.

 

 

 

  try it day after day and you may decide its not wise to always call someone in. as you discovered if the clinician decides you need it you will be xrayed. the issue here is was the patient care correct if it was were is the story. the nurse obviously mismanaged informing the patient.

We already pay for healthcare through NI contributions.  If I was the one who had been told no x-ray available, then I would have asked to speak to the hospital duty manager.

 

 so you believe in shouting it still does not mean you need an xray then and there. if you believe £2.75 pays for your care you clearly living in the past. http://www.sdhct.nhs.uk/uploads/23968.pdfis a very rou gh idea of costs. even if you went to the duty manager if the clinicians judgement is correct  you would still be waiting. none knows the real story here. odds are its somewhere in between the papers story and what the hospital said. lastly a minor brake will show better after a day or two its why your re xrayed if you attend the fracture clinic. if it was a mistake then the doctor/nurse will need to learn from it. but even with the best equipment brakes can be missed.    

 

£2.75?  The link you provided is for private and overseas patients, not a real like-for-like comparison.  And yes, I would have asked to speak to the hospital duty manager because a hospital is duty bound to provide certain core services ... or are you saying the Scottish Gov. give Shetland NHS/Health Board the money to provide such services but then not honour their contract?  Last time I checked we had a 24/7 A&E Dept., not a p/t one.

[paulb]

she was seen and deemed none urgent. none urgent means it can wait i dont know if they were correct neither do you. if you think everyone needs an urgent xray due to a minor foot injury your mistaken. if a clinician believes an injury warrants investigation it will be. thereare 2 issues here clinical need and financial ability. its not always wise to just xray everyone. most foot injuries are strains and sprains the a&e staff see many each week. those amounts are a rough idea of a procedures cost. £2.75 is the cost of your national insurance stamp. you do pay it i hope. the board are not funded to run 24/7 none urgent treatments. i would advice you look at the funding of the hospital services. they have been cut and face another 20% of cuts. and its not the Scottish governments fault its your Tory mates fault.

in fact if a person is sent to xray and the reason does not warrant it they will be refused. until the patients notes are seen this debate is pointless.   

[wotsit]

Hospitals often do not xray until any swelling has gone down, unless there is an open  fracture or no foot pulse or some other complication that would warrant an immediate urgent xray especially if immediate surgery was going to be considered.

 

 

Pain does not always warrant an immediate xray. Strains and sprains are often very painful.

Many foot and ankle injuries are strapped up and asked to come back in a day or two for an xray if required, chance for any swelling to reduce. Regardless whether its out of hours or not.

 

What was the final diagnosis of this patient foot was it broken or just a severe sprain in the end ?

 

Maybe the patient didn't hear correctly what she was being told or it was not put clearly enough to her.

Edited October 21, 2015 by wotsit

[paulb]

she fell on sunday was seen by her GP and was strapped up. she was in pain so went to the hospital on a bank holiday monday.  her doctor did not send her. so she was correctly told to return on a standard work day. definitely not a case for calling in staff. as they dont say its broken and they would have done if it was. it would make the story more news worthy. so apart from a possible poor conversation we only have her word for it. there was no miss treatment or even poor service. this story is not really a story. sprains are often more painful than brakes. a day after is when it will hurt most. as is the ability to walk on it. 

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

she was seen and deemed none urgent. none urgent means it can wait i dont know if they were correct neither do you. if you think everyone needs an urgent xray due to a minor foot injury your mistaken. if a clinician believes an injury warrants investigation it will be. thereare 2 issues here clinical need and financial ability. its not always wise to just xray everyone. most foot injuries are strains and sprains the a&e staff see many each week. those amounts are a rough idea of a procedures cost. £2.75 is the cost of your national insurance stamp. you do pay it i hope. the board are not funded to run 24/7 none urgent treatments. i would advice you look at the funding of the hospital services. they have been cut and face another 20% of cuts. and its not the Scottish governments fault its your Tory mates fault.

in fact if a person is sent to xray and the reason does not warrant it they will be refused. until the patients notes are seen this debate is pointless.   

 

How do you even know she was examined by a doctor?  A nurse told her x-rays weren't being done, the press report does not state whether or not the nurse even examined her.  So den, which majikal 'clinician' is one referring to?

 

Stone a crow, here we go, blaming the torys instead of the idiots who have been in power in Scotland for gawd knows how many yonks and learnt how to budget.  Nice to see that you appear to be implying that anyone exempt from NI should be paying it, how very generous of you there, paulb.  However, given I'm both self employed and PAYE, just to pander to your sheer nosy parkerness, I deffo pay more NI than that.  Happy now?

[paulb]

an anp is equal to a junior doctor. its not the snp thats cut funding its your pals in power.  scottish  gov has had a 10%cut due another 20%. as far as nosey parkerness comes in you take the biscuit.  

[Ghostrider]

an anp is equal to a junior doctor. its not the snp thats cut funding its your pals in power.  scottish  gov has had a 10%cut due another 20%.

 

Then the Scottish Government should be hammering hell out of Westminster to get funding increased, not sitting wringing their hands and whingeing about how hard done by they are. They're there to address the region's problems positively, not lounge back and point the finger of blame while doing nothing about the situation.

[paulb]

 

an anp is equal to a junior doctor. its not the snp thats cut funding its your pals in power.  scottish  gov has had a 10%cut due another 20%.

 

Then the Scottish Government should be hammering hell out of Westminster to get funding increased, not sitting wringing their hands and whingeing about how hard done by they are. They're there to address the region's problems positively, not lounge back and point the finger of blame while doing nothing about the situation.

 

so you want the snp to protect services you dont believe in. after all you 2 claim yo have voted ukip. but dont worry a few more years of tory power and you wont need to worry about a&e care. snp prevented the bedroom tax and is doing as much as it can to prevent our services  from being destroyed.