Ghostrider Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 its still public money. in a way even more so. it must be my socialist attitude that feels that public money should not be used to benefit the few. Can I take it then that you are a vehement anti-Viking Energy supporter then, as exactly the same rule applies to that "investment". I think in most folk's minds they'd concede with this boat there's a reasonably good liklihood of the money being repaid in full, with interest, thereby growing the public's funds - which if as I suspect this is Development Trust money, means some of that return ultimately gets distributed to local charities. Its a tried and tested venture by an experienced group of individuals, unlike some other pie in the sky get rich quick schemes being backed by similar money, with a significant portion of the folk planning to run them having no knowledge of the industry they are attempting to move in to, and often having no business experience of any kind at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulb Posted March 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 would it not be good if they could publish all their investments ie failed as well as successful. and what has been raised/lost. would that be a breach of any rule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostrider Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 ^ If indeed SDT business, you can view their current overall performance on the SIC site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 just a few words about honest fishermen. Shetland catch black fish landings. Yes, and they couldn't have been that 'honest' without the shoreside help.... Facts Paul, facts.. Every industry has it's 'bad eggs' but, like I was careful to say, MOST fishermen and, until you can prove otherwise, I will stand by that.. Either way, I would rather see the SDA/SIC/Whatever putting money into a local business that is going to provide employment onshore and offshore than wasting it by 'tilting at windmills' etc. Down the years, the SIC/SDA has poured millions into knitwear and salmon farms. Where are they now? The bulk of the salmon farms are foreign owned and the knitwear industry has been reduced to a 'rump'. As for agriculture, Shetland doesn't have any. A few guys growing tatties doesn't amount to an industry and, the only reason there are sheep is because the crofters get a decent subsidy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian.smith Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 , the only reason there are sheep is because the crofters get a decent subsidy. Oh dear thats a different argument but I can assure you its no get rich scheme for those of us who operate to produce a product hate to think what my hourly rate is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulb Posted March 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 i wish the EU would pour some my way. i agree that there is nothing more wrong in the fishing fleet than any other group. what im saying badly as always is that there are better ways of creating jobs than by lending 5 fishermen a load of cash.small seed corn funding for start up workers would be a nice one.even a local job support scheme that gives 6 months work at decent wages for the unemployed.even spending some on treating the drug addicts/offenders would make a big impact if only 1 or 2 were cured.supporting cope better would create more jobs. and insure that a vulnerable group were supported.even a local food bank/ co-operative for food would help the poor.loads and loads of thing jump to mind. why has the fishing sector not become a co-op and invested some of there earnings in future capital schemes. we are told that is worth tons but they need our money for quota and for buying new boats. its either viable or not. even crofters could earn more if we had new tractors/sheds feed and other stuff offered to us cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostrider Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 why has the fishing sector not become a co-op and invested some of there earnings in future capital schemes. we are told that is worth tons but they need our money for quota and for buying new boats. its either viable or not. even crofters could earn more if we had new tractors/sheds feed and other stuff offered to us cheap. WSF were a co-op with something of that general idea in mind, but as the local fleet size declined due it seemed to mainly EU insistence and a few alleged bad debtors, there wasn't enough local trade to keep two agencies (which was WSF's mainstay business) going. There was the SIC's 10 year agricultural plan that started in the 80's that supported pretty much any enterprise that a crofter could show was viable, but it seemed once the architects of that plan in the Development Dept, and the SAC moved on, retired etc, it largely withered away. The lime and fertiliser grants, heifers grants etc which the SIC finally pulled the plug on recently were the last remnants of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorrie Posted March 13, 2014 Report Share Posted March 13, 2014 i wish the EU would pour some my way. i agree that there is nothing more wrong in the fishing fleet than any other group. what im saying badly as always is that there are better ways of creating jobs than by lending 5 fishermen a load of cash...... So what you are saying is that a proven viable Shetland business should not be supported by Shetland finance to upgrade? How queer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Gorgonzola Butt-cheese Posted March 14, 2014 Popular Post Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 (edited) You didn't read much of the reply posts did you Paulb ?This loan helps modernize one of the key assets in Shetland's No.1 industry - A fishing vessel that catches and brings to shore fresh protein for human consumption. Fish. Shetland was built on this industry.The profits from the catching of this fish filters through the wider Shetland economy helping to keep a large variety of businesses and there employees going.Marine Engineering and electrical firms, net mending and wire equipment providers , fish buyers , mongers , filleters and their drivers, ice factories , janitorial supplies and general merchants shops. It is a simple fact of our geography and climate here in Shetland that if you or any other small holder were given this same amount of cash as a loan to develop land crops or some other alternative it would be impossible to bring to market even 1/10th of the value or volume of this fishing vessel and the loan would never be repaid . Edited March 14, 2014 by Gorgonzola Butt-cheese Rasmie, Colin and Muppet 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biglad Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 Re black fish landings……..from the skippers of the boats to the forklift driver stacking the trucks full of blackfish to the counter assistant in a shop selling those blackfish EVERYONE made money out of that, including the taxman! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulb Posted March 15, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 are you say that its ok to make money from fraud/crime. paying tax on criminal proceeds has always happened. the ladies of negotiable values are meant to pay tax on their earnings. one wonders if they charge vat to their customers. if you want our future based on crime/iffy practices lets become a tax free zone and import loads of bankers it works for the isle of man and the channel isles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostrider Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 are you say that its ok to make money from fraud/crime. In a word, "yes", pretty much. Your so called "fraud"/"crime" only exists in so called "laws" dreamed up and "enforced" by other humans, and in the moral judgements of other humans by any given individual human. While I have no issue with one human making a judgement call on another for the purposes of forming their own personal opinion, I object to one human, or group of humans attempting to enforce their personal opinions of other peoples actions on everyone else. In other words what you may judge to be a "crime" or a "fraud", probably is considered a perfectly just and fair transaction by some others. brian.smith 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulb Posted March 15, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 society judges it to be a crime. innocent fishermen suffered because those harmless blackfish reduced the market price. the quota cuts hit the innocent and the guilty equally. so yes it does meet what i believe a crime is. these guys were not poor struggling fishermen. now things like discards i object too. its immoral to waste perfectly good fish because its the wrong type/size. these fish could be re classed as bycatch and sold at brake even whether to schools/hospitals or at cost to the needy. maybe our quota bank could help with this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B/M/S Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 (edited) Yes they should get the loan but the clause should be no cheap labour employed from the phillipines ! The greed in this industry is shocking ! I have nothing against foriegn workers but if they are here they deserve the same pay as the rest Edited March 15, 2014 by B/M/S shetlandpeat 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostrider Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 society judges it to be a crime. I'm not a big fan of "society" and especially of their "judgement", and am only a very reluctant minimally participating member of it, by default of it not being realistically possible to avoid some bits of it without leaving the planet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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