Waste management

[shetlandpeat]

Time to change them into something that can work for communities.

 

However, reading some of the achievements and the small grants given to projects, there are too many really to mention.

It is saddening that you have a perpetual negative mantra regarding this, and its community benefits. However, hopefully, folk reading this may take a look and decide for themselves.

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

Time to change them into something that can work for communities.

 

 

 

Yep, abolish them works for me and a lot of folk I know quite well!  They've done sweet FA for years apart from big up their own egos, are undemocratic, cost too much and for what?  All in the name of those in power pretending to encourage democracy - no thanks, just scrap them.

[shetlandpeat]

I am sure you know of all the work all the CCs do, however, you are entitled to an opinion.

 

So, now we have scrapped them, what mechanisms would you put in place to inseminate information to the smaller communities? The information passed on either via in person at meetings or through the notice boards are for some, the only link they may have to the greater Shetland.

Who will administer the grants, how will they be represented?

 

Getting rid of community groups is not the answer, you are in a position to join said council and then get enough support to dissolve it, I doubt you will do that though, I guess you are not like UKIP and hate the EU but think the only way to get rid of it is from within. I would guess with your many friends, you could make it happen.

 

The Delting group seem to be reasonable active, they also facilitate grants though have issues with the ASCC however, if your CC is not doing the following then yes you ave a right to complain, did we mention voluntary? It is what folk do, for free.

 

• Community Councils are voluntary bodies established within a statutory framework.
• There is a lively Community Council scene in Shetland with 18 Community Councils representing the isles. (WAS)
• Community Councils are a voice for their local community, representing the views of the community to the SIC and other public bodies and acting to further the interests of their communities.
• Each Community Council (CC) meets as often as is necessary to fulfil their duties, usually every 4-6 weeks.
• All planning and works licence applications for the area are considered, and then CC views fed to the planning department.
• The SIC Councillor(s) for the area usually attends CC meetings and people from outside agencies are often invited to discuss current issues.
• Community Councils have representatives at many SIC forums, and report back from them.
• Applications for financial assistance are considered by members, e.g. for local groups or for road grants.
• Members are asked for comments on a wide range of consultation papers from many outside agencies such as the SIC or NHS Shetland, members will consider these items within the context of their community. Issues covered could include transport / roads / local housing.

All the above will need addressing still and organising. How would this be done? Paid officers of the council?

 

I do remember though both of you have your own issues with councils (SIC and CC) and I would guess you may not have had dealings with all.

 

Still, while they are there, petition them to put a skip up every now and then.

[Colin]

 

Time to change them into something that can work for communities.

 

 

 

Yep, abolish them works for me and a lot of folk I know quite well!  They've done sweet FA for years apart from big up their own egos, are undemocratic, cost too much and for what?  All in the name of those in power pretending to encourage democracy - no thanks, just scrap them.

 

I don't know if you are just taking a 'pop' at SP or, do you genuinely believe the above to be true?

 

Anyway, not taking sides here but, I have to take issue with your post.

Personal experience (from the inside) would suggest that;

There is very little ego building

They are very democratic and, all present get to air their views (this includes members of the public who can be bothered to attend)

They cost 'peanuts' to run (it's all voluntary except for the clerk, who gets paid) compared with the vast amounts of cash that the SIC costs.

They help various local groups and individuals, where they can, with small grants etc.

They appear to have a little more 'clout' than Joe Public alone when dealing with officials.

 

What they lack is support from their communities for trying to do, what appears to be, quite a thankless exercise..

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

Colin, I'm serious.  Scrap them.  We're lucky if the website containing the minutes gets updated every few months and there hasn't been a leaflet drop around the community since something like 2009.  The minutes are sometimes on display down the local post office.  So if you can't get down the local post office, you've no idea what they've been discussing and voting on until its too late.  They make decisions without consulting the community they supposedly represent and have their own pet projects.  Oh, and several of them voted regarding the VE community fund; again, without even consulting the very people they are meant to represent.

 

Have you seen the amount it costs to run a CC?  I was quite surprised at the amount a clerk gets paid; if our local CC is anything to go by, it certainly isn't value for money.  As to the comment about grants for local groups, where does a CC get the money from for such grants ... wouldn't be the SIC by any chance, would it?

 

Edit:  And there's some people who have been community councillors since the beginning; even if a couple of new councillors did get on the CC, they'd have no clout because the same old deadwood refuses to budge and change their ways; that's why so many aren't interested in standing from what I've heard.  Perhaps limit the number of years people can be community councillors?

 

If there's a total lack of interest and apathy in CCs, it's because of how they've behaved.  People aren't fools, they know they have no clout.

 

And judging by the minutes I have read, the SIC officials treat the CCs with the same amount of disdain they treat Joe Public with.

Edited October 4, 2014 by Suffererof1crankymofo

[shetlandpeat]

They have a public meeting, if you cannot be bothered to go it is your perogitive, but you cannot say that they did not consult. As Colin said, their biggest problem is folk who do nothing. You have had the chance to petition them, join them and meet with them, any correspondance to the clerk goes to meeting.

 

Do you think the grants will be the same if administered by an officer at the council (SIC) without the opportunity of public engagement? At least you have the opportunity.

 

I would suggest you have another go and get involved, you may even be able to do away with the statutory bit if you persist.

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

Peat, when you don't know when the next meeting is as they publish the minutes when they are approved at the next meeting, you'd have to be psychic.  Contact the clerk?  I've phoned more than once, still waiting for a call back from months ago.  Agendas published for next meetings?  Err nope.

 

And I have telephoned more than one of the community councillors in the past - they don't like it when you disagree with their view points.

 

And as for grants, why the hell are local community councils paying for road materials for non-adopted access roads?

[shetlandpeat]

You have waited months for a call back? Wow.

 

Anyhow, the next meeting is on the 27th of October at Dunrossness Primary School, it starts at 7.30, the next meeting after that will be at the same venue, same time but on the 24th November.

 

The Clerk, can be contacted via clerk@dunrossnesscc.shetland.co.uk

 

You will already know the number.

 

Just for your information, the meeting date have been published since January as has the details of membership. Billy Fox is an ex-officio, I thought you would have kept in contact since his rise to council (SIC)

 

 

Peat, when you don't know when the next meeting is as they publish the minutes when they are approved at the next meeting, you'd have to be psychic.  Contact the clerk?  I've phoned more than once, still waiting for a call back from months ago.  Agendas published for next meetings?  Err nope.

 

Now then, I have found the dates of the meetings, and the minutes of last meetings, the recent meeting of the 29th September has not been published but the August minutes are available (with the date of the next meeting).

 

I am wondering why you do not go to a meeting rather than ring individual representatives up, what you say will be minuted and available for all to see on their web site.

 

Their site is a bit lacking, however, I am sure someone with resonable skills could improve it, however, much of the impotant stuff is there, as it is on the SIC (council) web site.

 

I bet there is an emailing list!

 

http://www.shetland.gov.uk/coins//allCommunityCouncilMeetings.asp?bodyid=234&bodytitle=Dunrossness%20Community%20Council&MeetingYear=2014

 

http://www.dunrossnesscc.shetland.co.uk/index.html

 

http://www.dunrossnesscc.shetland.co.uk/minutes/2014/aug14min.pdf

 

Perhaps you could mention the community skips

 

I look forward to reading questions from the public in the October Minutes.

Edited October 4, 2014 by shetlandpeat

[MuckleJoannie]

The SIC have always given money for community councils to pay for the upkeep of unadopted roads. It is allowed under the Roads (Scotland) Act 1984 and many other local authorities in Scotland do the same.

[shetlandpeat]

And as for grants, why the hell are local community councils paying for road materials for non-adopted access roads?

It keeps the community mobile, allows for emergency services and helps community inclusion.

 

There is an item on street lights, I know you were a little animated about them, they are to be included in the Gateway 2015 for funding.

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

And if I need to raise anything with the SIC, I'm capable of firing off an e-mail or contacting Billy Fox; I sure as hell don't need an unelected but there by default community council to speak for me ... and nor, it would seem, do many of my neighbours.

 

We've mentioned streetlights, the SIC promised the CC that residents would be written to, we weren't.  What do the minutes say month after month?  Nothing to report; in fact, on most items it's "nothing to report".

 

Oh look, they voted on police officers routinely carrying firearms.  Was anything on the [invisible] agenda prior to the meeting?  Nope, per usual, they just did what the hell they thought; no consultation.

 

Who knows, perhaps a new bunch of councillors would do better but I doubt it.  Confidence in a community council?  No.  Agree they should exist?  No.  Think the SIC listen to them?  No.

[Ghostrider]

2013/14 Core funding budget

 

Community Council - Funding Allocated

Aithsting & Sandsting - £10,218.00

Bressay - £5,802.00

Burra & Trondra - £5,998.00

Delting - £11,317.00

Dunrossness - £9,546.00

Fetlar - £3,626.00

Gulberwick,Quarff & Cunningsburgh - £9,923.00

Lerwick - £20,923.00

Nesting & Lunnasting - £7,127.00

Northmavine - £12,667.00

Sandness & Walls - £9,227.00

Sandwick - £8,034.00

Scalloway - £7,258.00

Skerries - £3,426.00

Tingwall,Whiteness & Weisdale - £8,306.00

Unst - £8,423.00

Whalsay - £7,696.00

Yell - £8,531.00

Total - £158,048.00

Association of Shetland Community Coun - £12,743.00

Total Budget - 2013/14 - £170,791.00

 

What has Shetland gained from that £170k spend (thats £468 per day!) that wouldn't have been as easily and more cheaply provided from within the SIC machine? They might just have managed to cut the Admin and overheads from servicing all these talking shops by £70k if they did, which could have covered the cost of the skips, and we'd still have them.

Edited October 4, 2014 by Ghostrider

[shetlandpeat]

I doubt there would be the opportunity of community involvement as there is now. Where would they have saved the £70k? If they did, there are far more important things to spend it on than rubbish. Ask a carer.

 

Perhaps you could ask the recipients of the grants as well.

[Ghostrider]

I doubt there would be the opportunity of community involvement as there is now. Where would they have saved the £70k? If they did, there are far more important things to spend it on than rubbish. Ask a carer.

 

Perhaps you could ask the recipients of the grants as well.

 

Peat, there is NO community involvement right now, end of. Each CC employs a paid clerk, don't try and tell me that not having to pay eighteen clerks wouldn't go quite some way towards saving £70k, even if some of the Admin they do was taken over by other SIC departments - Remember, the greatest part of any clerk's work is attending to the paperwork of the CC's meetings themselves - ergo, no CC, no meetings, no resulting paperwork. What Admin exists over and above that is a relatively small workload.

 

The same money that the CCs hand out for grants would still be there, and more besides when you stop paying for the costs of all these little meetings all around the countryside. The SIC have, and have had for a very long time their own grant systems which administers them to just about every organisation you can think of throughout Shetland, a handful more applications going through that already existing framework would hardly be noticed.

 

I'm not going to argue there are numerous other things far more deserving of having funds thrown at them than rubbish, and that is exactly my point. The vast majority of the £170k budget is wasted on an un-necessary ineffective and pointless charade, scrap them all and spend the money on something, anything elsewhere that is more deserving and does make a positive impact of people's lives. I really don't much care what it is that its spent on, as it couldn't possibly be spent on much that's more pointless than where its going at the moment.

 

The old District Councils which existed back in the day of the ZCC had in many cases long since died a death from disinterest and disillusionment decades before the ZCC eventually went to Valhalla. CCs are little different or better than the old District Councils were, but folk have given them a chance, and its a miracle they're still there after 40 years, but the writing is on the wall.

Edited October 4, 2014 by Ghostrider

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

I doubt there would be the opportunity of community involvement as there is now. Where would they have saved the £70k? If they did, there are far more important things to spend it on than rubbish. Ask a carer.

 

Perhaps you could ask the recipients of the grants as well.

 

Errr I AM a Carer!  And speaking as one, it was a LOT easier to get rid of rubbish when we did have the community skips!

 

Well, he did ask ...