JustMe Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 I think if there was a referendum tomorrow on Scottish Independence the ayes would have it. And yes we need a better system to elect MPs. I would go for full proportional representation which might mean the BNP and even the Monster Raving Loony party got a seat or two but that would be the price for true democracy. Colin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulb Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 yes it really does need to happen. but it wont. tories will do their boundary fix and insure a whopping majority. no way would they accept PR. if they did they would be voting themselves out of power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capeesh Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 The Electoral Reform Society tweeted what the results would have been under a fair voting system (I'm assuming proportional representation)Number of seats:CON 244LAB 201UKIP 83LD 52SNP 31Greens 25DUP 3PC 3SF 3UUP 2SDLP 2Alliance 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulb Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 less keen on ukip supporting a tory government Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 Yes, the 'joke' is on the whole country but, if anything, the 'joke' is also on the SNP. They so desperately needed a hung parliament in order to exert any pressure at all. Instead they have 50 (or so) MP's who are just going to be totally ignored unless/until the government faces a back bench revolt. The problem we have at the moment is that the government can (almost) rightfully claim that we turned down a chance of PR a couple of years ago but, AV (as proposed) was not in any way PR and was designed to maintain the status quo. Labour et al got 'humped' in Scotland because the government was to slow offering reforms(?) after the referendum and the public, quite rightly, realised that they were going to continue being screwed so, in many way, the SNP were riding a protest vote to westminster. The real tragedy about the whole process is that so many voters are now not fully represented and, the current political system is, indeed, broken. The Tories saw their total vote decline to less than Labours yet, they gained seatsLabour saw their total vote increase and polled more than the Tories for the first time in years yet, they lost seats.UKIP took a very creditable 4,000,000 votes and only got 1 seatThe Greens took 1,500,000 votes and only got 1 seatThe SNP took 1,500,000 votes and got more than 50The LibDems got their pay-back for getting into bed with the Tories without effectively marking a series of 'Red Lines" that they would not cross and,rather than bring down the government, thought they could brazen it out. The whole system is perverse..... Huge problem for the government is that the general public has re-awakened it's 'political awareness' (and dragged themselves away from ther games consoles) and have begun to realise this and will now start to demand fair representation. Doing nothing is not an option unless, of course, they want to deal with riots. I mean, how can you afford the latest console if your benefits have been cut. Better riot and steal one along the way.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 I would go for full proportional representation which might mean the BNP and even the Monster Raving Loony party got a seat or two but that would be the price for true democracy.If any of the 'undesireable' parties gained sufficient support, then the people who voted for them would be entitled to be represented and have their voices heard. It worked for George Galloway, why not anyone else? Anyway, the 'political classes' in this country are in serious need of a hard kick in the region most of us use for sitting on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 yes it really does need to happen. but it wont. tories will do their boundary fix and insure a whopping majority. no way would they accept PR. if they did they would be voting themselves out of power. Agreed but, more correctly, they (and Labour) would be voting themselves out of majority and whichever political party then wanted to run the country, would have to enter into some form of coalition in order to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorgonzola Butt-cheese Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/generalelection/ukip-supporters-are-convinced-nigel-farages-defeat-is-a-conspiracy-10239252.html It's NOT just UKIP supporters who think there is something odd about the election results. If there has been a rigged election it effects ALL voters of every party. This sort of reporting is only trying to divert the issue to an easy mockable target!A van with 200,000 votes goes missing (NOT local voting slips), recounts after "extra" ballot boxes are found, a toddler receiving a polling card, people reporting that they couldn't vote because either: they had "already" voted, they weren't "registered" even though they'd registered several times, postal votes not arriving on time or arriving at all etc, a judge warning of serious issues with postal voting that could result in fraud. Polling companies investigating how they got ALL of their polls wrong, and so on etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorgonzola Butt-cheese Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 I'd really like to know why in 2015 in something as important as running the country we are provided with PENCILS to vote with?.Some people say it's in case you put an X in the wrong box, did anyone see an eraser in the polling booths Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustMe Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 I voted with a ball point pen and any voter can take their own pen into the polling booth with them and use that to vote. But if we assume that most of the people counting the votes are honest then surely a vote having been tampered with would be noticed. Incidentally if you put your cross in the wrong place you go back to the officials with your paper and get a fresh one. As for the van with all the postal ballots and other stories about ex-pats not being able to vote in time assuming they are fairly well split among constituencies and parties they would vote for I really do not think it would have affected the result. Which leads me to another point. Why should ex-pats be able to vote anyway. Fair enough if they are working abroad on a short term contract but why, if they have decided to move away from the UK to live in another country should they be able to vote in UK elections for the first 15 years they are away. Would make more sense to give prisoners the vote since at least they are affected by government decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 "It's NOT just UKIP supporters who think there is something odd about the election results." Can't remember exactly who said it or, how it was said but, I believe that Stalin quoted "who votes does not matter, it's the man that counts the votes that has the power". gafynandrew 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hjasga Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 (edited) I'd really like to know why in 2015 in something as important as running the country we are provided with PENCILS to vote with?. Some people say it's in case you put an X in the wrong box, did anyone see an eraser in the polling booths Pencils have always been used in UK elections and are arguably more secure than pen. It's an indelible wax pencil, not just a light HB graphite that could be quickly erased. If for any reason the votes were to get wet, you'd risk ink-based marks running or being lost, but pencil marks are fine. Pens could also transfer some marks upon folding whereas the pencils do not. But I expect the core reason is still just cost. Edited May 11, 2015 by hjasga Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Interesting to see that George Galloway is taking legal advice because he lost his 11,000 majority. Just can't acccept losing such a massive majority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostrider Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 ^ Thats a lot to lose all at once, you'd thought he'd have noticed before it got that bad. Must have been a bit like maggots dropping of a purtrid corpse in Galloway's case. as 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Yep, posted it because AC lost a similar quantity to the SNP and, he's not "shouting the odds" about it (mind you, he did win(?)). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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