Is there a God - or isn't there?

[Ghostrider]

In some ways, this is a fairly non-productive discussion as neither side can absolutely prove, or disprove, the existence of a god(s), and the many religions that surround us are nothing more than artificial constructs of human origin.

 

Surely the onus is on the 'believers' to prove the existence. Disproving existence can't be done, regardless of subject matter.

 

I'll tip my hat to the mind(s) that conceived 'God'/religion though, as what they created must be near perfect to convince the masses that it exists, without having to produce one shred on tangible evidence of its existence.

 

As an exercise in mind control and capitalising upon inherent human fears and weaknesses, it excells.

 

It seems one of very few ways not to be drawn in in some way by it all, is to be someone who when the 'Why am I here', 'What is the purpose of life', 'What happens when I die' etc type questions come up. Can truthfully answer 'Don't know, don't care' to them all.

Edited October 14, 2018 by Ghostrider

[Lerwick antiques]

It's hard to imagine how a nation of "believers" can be taken in by the bible, as there is no evidence any of this is true or exists.

 

I think it's more of folk believing what they want to believe. To some folk, going to heaven after death is a comforting thought, being reincarnated is a comforting thought, some find eternal darkness as a comforting thought, some find "going to paradise" a comforting thought.    

 

Many folk get into religion after doing a crime, drugs etc and confession their "sins" helps them make peace with what they have done to folk, society or themselves.

 

As for spirits/ghosts, strangely there is more evidence to support that theory through sightings etc, but I would also discount this until I see a ghost of a dead person then might believe that.

 

Many folk are follow religion as it's what they want to believe and what brings them comfort.

 

Bearing in mind, there has been many occasions where folk has committed terrible crimes against society or a person as this is what they claim to be correct through their perception of the bible.

[tarsus]

What about cases where people have been visited by someone who seems to have come to say goodby  then the person finds out that the visitor died before he was seen.

[Colin]

 

In some ways, this is a fairly non-productive discussion as neither side can absolutely prove, or disprove, the existence of a god(s), and the many religions that surround us are nothing more than artificial constructs of human origin.

 

Surely the onus is on the 'believers' to prove the existence. Disproving existence can't be done, regardless of subject matter.

 

I'll tip my hat to the mind(s) that conceived 'God'/religion though, as what they created must be near perfect to convince the masses that it exists, without having to produce one shred on tangible evidence of its existence.

 

As an exercise in mind control and capitalising upon inherent human fears and weaknesses, it excells.

 

It seems one of very few ways not to be drawn in in some way by it all, is to be someone who when the 'Why am I here', 'What is the purpose of life', 'What happens when I die' etc type questions come up. Can truthfully answer 'Don't know, don't care' to them all.

 

Agreed.

[Ghostrider]

What about cases where people have been visited by someone who seems to have come to say goodby  then the person finds out that the visitor died before he was seen.

 

I think you're heading down the road of ESP there, rather than 'religion'.

 

There are endless accounts of folk making some sort of invisible and unknown 'connection' with each other, even if it should be nothing more than someone comes to mind for reason, only for the phone to then ring and its that person calling, for it to be entirely written off to 'coincidence'.

 

Theories to explain it are scarce though, and AFAIK 'religion' hasn't been in the habit of stepping up and accepting blame for it either.

[Lerwick antiques]

Does "religion" not mean "folks believes"

[Lerwick antiques]

If I am right, the court follows the bible and that's where the laws comes from. Like, for example, who said it's a crime to murder? it's been made a crime as that is what is in the bible. When they used to hang criminals then that would have been the high court following "an eye for an eye" in the bible.

 

Also, witches or witchcraft was another old believe, don't know if it could be called a religion though. But it was illegal to practice witchcraft and many women were drowned or burned due to the witchcraft laws. Think the last woman to be tried under the witchcraft law in Scotland was Helen Duncan, who was a medium, that was in the 1940/50s.

[Spinner72]

I have found religion in general quite a bizarre phenomenon since I was a bairn. I have never seen any mystery in the questions others seem to turn to religion for (as Ghostrider mentioned) - we are here because of something our folks did, the purpose of life is to live and die, and when we die that's it. Dead. All completely obvious and indisputable.

 

 

What I do find disturbing is the way that certain religious aspects are still allowed in todays society. The legal system is one, and the other, which I expect may raise some discussion, is the imposition of religious beliefs upon children. I really resent the fact I have been brainwashed into being able to recite the lords prayer, yet I am aware I got off lucky by many standards.

[Sacre Bleu]

I think it's a shame when discussion about faith and religion doesn't get beyond whether or not God exists (not that this is the case here).

 

What I find most interesting is why religion is so pervasive. (Almost) every culture throughout history has had some kind of faith system.

 

The post-Enlightenment western expectation that religion would die out in the face of scientific advances hasn't happened apart from a decline in western Europe and a few other places.

 

There are many theories that a societal framework such as religion was so evolutionarily advantageous that humans have evolved to have a predisposition for religious belief. Religion provides a shared narrative and core values that groups of people united under. Science doesn't provide the same function.

[Sacre Bleu]

If I am right, the court follows the bible and that's where the laws comes from. Like, for example, who said it's a crime to murder? it's been made a crime as that is what is in the bible. When they used to hang criminals then that would have been the high court following "an eye for an eye" in the bible.

 

Most societies throughout history have not tolerated murder. It's a basic tenant of living communally. Religion doesn't have exclusivity on that.

[Ghostrider]

^ Semantics. Society just redefines the same act from being 'murder' to being 'lawful killing' when it suits any given society to do so. Kiiling is killing, just because a given society enacts a statute that makes certain types of killing 'lawful' in that society, doesn't alter the act itself in any way, or define it as anything other than 'murder' in the eyes of someone of another society.

 

Its a classic case of dressing up an act to be something else thats acceptable in one set of circumstances, but vilefying that exact same act in other circumstances.

 

Most societies worldwide today have evolved from religiously based societies. Some have evolved more than others for sure, but even among the most, so-called, 'advanced' societies far too much still remains within them that is there for no other reason than its how the religious society they evolved from did it.

 

Marriage hasn't moved much from its religious ceremony and 'laws', neither have funerals and burial practices, our Government has people in it (or did not that long ago) who are only there because they hold senior positions within certain religious organisations, even on a local level the Council's Education Committee has a seat reserved for a 'religious representative'. Ministers of religion are still regularly 'looked up to', considered 'professionals' and appointed to public bodies to lord over the rest of us. When in reality many consider them peddlars of fiction and fantasy, who are getting a free ride through life on everyone else's back.

[Lerwick antiques]

Why does the uk courts still have the oath of holding the bible and saying "I will tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth" or something like that. The whole court system follows christian believes and the bible.

Edited October 15, 2018 by Lerwick antiques

[Colin]

Why does the uk courts still have the oath of holding the bible and saying "I will tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth" or something like that. The whole court system follows christian believes and the bible.

Do you not have the option to swear a different oath if you wish ?  Can't imagine our "christian" oath cutting much ice with muslims etc.

[George.]

Why does the uk courts still have the oath of holding the bible and saying "I will tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth" or something like that. The whole court system follows christian believes and the bible.

Swearing on, or at, a bible won't affect us Atheists very much.

 

Judges bid to banish the bible

Edited October 15, 2018 by George.

[Sacre Bleu]

 

Why does the uk courts still have the oath of holding the bible and saying "I will tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth" or something like that. The whole court system follows christian believes and the bible.

Do you not have the option to swear a different oath if you wish ?  Can't imagine our "christian" oath cutting much ice with muslims etc.

 

 

In the UK there are the options to:

• take a religious "oath" according to belief such as "I swear by (diety/religious belief) that the evidence I shall give shall be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth."
• or make a non-religious "affirmation" such as "I do solemnly, sincerely and truly declare and affirm that the evidence I shall give shall be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth."