Shetland windfarm - Viking Energy

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

a large turbine farm will be built. it may not be by us but it will be built. as will one on yell fetlar and unst. alternative is what. 2 billion pound power plants. 

 

I thought wind farms were the £2 billion lack of power plants.

[James Mackenzie]

Paul, I may have to "join in" with VE if the windfarm goes ahead because of my job (though I'm fairly sure I'd be retired by then!), and I'd have to swallow my own antipathy to the project and be professional about it. But if I were to wear my Sustainable Shetland hat, no way would I be sitting down with them to plan alternative road routes etc. For one thing, I'm a layperson as far as that's concerned, and for another I don't think I'd be welcome, if only for that reason. But I repeat what I wrote above - alternative layouts apart from "micro-siting" are not an option. Consent was given for the current layout. Any major departure from the project plan would require a new application.

Your second point about pools on ridges - they do and can form on hill summits and ridges, which are actually the centres of actively forming blanket bog. This is not as surprising as it might sound, as precipitation levels tend to be highest at these elevations. Futher north on the Mid Kame you can see other pools which have spontaneously formed where there's previously been eroded and bare peat; most probably such recovery has been due to reduction of grazing pressure. It's quite possible that this landslip was at such a site, and until it's inspected by experts we can only speculate as to the reasons.

I find it sadly ironic, however, that VE would, with its road and vast turbine bases, tear up this tract of recovering and carbon-capturing bog - which may have taken up to a hundred years to get to its current state.

[Ghostrider]

a large turbine farm will be built. it may not be by us but it will be built. as will one on yell fetlar and unst. alternative is what. 2 billion pound power plants. 

 

Power plants, whatever their price, aren't alternatives to a windfarm in Shetland's situation, they're necessary whatever else Shetland may, or may not have. The alternative to no local power plants is lights out when the wind drops and/or the cable to the National Grid develops an issue. This point has been well ruminated over and laboured from virtually Day 1.

[ArabiaTerra]

 

 

 

 

 

I'm no roads engineer but I'd hazard a guess that roadbuilding was a contributing factor in landslips shown in both these photos, and not even a great depth of peat by the looks of things.

http://www.shetnews.co.uk/news/9048-a-month-s-worth-of-rain-in-a-day

 

"A months worth of rain in a day". The headline speaks for itself. And how does the road affect things up-hill of the road?

 

Easy - if it is uphill of the road, the road has cut through/across the layer of peat on the hill destabilising it and contributes to it breaking away above the road and flowing down over it.  Seems like common sense to me, of course the 'headline' has also been a contributing factor, I didn't say the building of the roads was the main cause.

 

 

And the point I've been trying to make, and obviously failing, is that Shetland is already covered with roads that cut up, down, along and through the peat willy-nilly, with no obvious ill-effects on the peat. These roads have been there for decades . and there has been no peat apocalypse. The landslides which have been happening with increasing frequency bear no relation to the roads anywhere near them. They have been caused by extreme rainfall which is a result of Climate Change. This is unstoppable. It will continue until there is no peat left on the sides of any of the hills in Shetland whether or not the windfarm gets built.

 

Which makes all this speculation about the windfarm causing landslides pointless. The landslides will continue anyway, windfarm or no.

[paulb]

sorry my numbers were out a little it will be 29 billion per new nuclear power station. for that we could cover 1/2 of the uk in solar build millions of turbines and rebuild leaky houses to super insulated ones. we are planning to spend just under £500 quid per person for one power station. the rubbish of trying to say china will fund it is rubbish. we will be paying and added interest as well. and in 50 odd years we will be required to decommission and store deadly waste for millions of years. we still dont know were to store our waste from the 1960s. you may not like turbines and some dont but you do need to realize there is no choice its needed for our future energy need. 

[George.]

sorry my numbers were out a little it will be 29 billion per new nuclear power station. for that we could cover 1/2 of the uk in solar build millions of turbines and rebuild leaky houses to super insulated ones. we are planning to spend just under £500 quid per person for one power station. the rubbish of trying to say china will fund it is rubbish. we will be paying and added interest as well. and in 50 odd years we will be required to decommission and store deadly waste for millions of years. we still dont know were to store our waste from the 1960s. you may not like turbines and some dont but you do need to realize there is no choice its needed for our future energy need. 

 

And who are inflicting the nuclear power stations upon us, apart from the Tories?

 

You're right, nobody.

 

And why are they inflicting these power stations upon us, is it because they are the newest, cheapest and most productive source of electricity for everybody?

 

You're right, no. It's so that they can make huge amounts of money and damn the price that the common man has to pay, the pollution it causes and the time it takes to sort out the the ones that have come to the end of their time.

 

Remember Dounreay? It's too close to Shetland      

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

@paulb & George - I'm no fan of nuclear but it's more reliable than wind power.  Wind power cannot match the output from other means.  As for insulation, not all houses benefit from being over-insulated.

[Capeesh]

Are these the Nuclear power stations at Hinkley in Somerset and Sizewell in Suffolk where the UK government has guaranteed a price of £92.50 per megawatt hour which is DOUBLE the going rate on the wholesale markets, it is such a ridiculously high price that equity analysts term it "financial insanity"

Why are we paying through the nose subsidising French and Chinese state owned companies for our electricity?

Edited November 3, 2015 by Capeesh

[George.]

Why are we paying through the nose subsidising French and Chinese state owned companies for our electricity?

 

Because the toadies, sorry, tories are into profiteering in a big way and they will profit - and we, the common man, will pay for it.

Edited November 3, 2015 by George.

[Urabug]

Why could VE not become the energy supplier for Shetland,providing electricty,coal,gas and oil at non or next to non profitable prices for everyone living on these islands .

 

As long as they did not make a loss and a very modest profit this would surely be of benifit to us all. 

 

Instead of paying our bills to companys like SSE and local companys we would pay VE thus lining our own pockets and not those of others!

[Wheelsup]

They would need to charge plenty to pay for a back up generator to keep the power consistent when the wind turbines can't produce power.

Anyhow they already stated that we wouldn't get cheap power as we'd only waste it.

[Urabug]

Wheelsup---I'm thinking more along the lines of things as they are at the moment. It's not who generates the power but who you pay the bill to .

 

I can chose any of  several companys as my service provider at the moment,to me they are the unnecessary middle men,the wholesellers .

 

If we must have "wholesellers " then let us keep it local and all the profits they make on the islands

Edited November 3, 2015 by Urabug

[Middlin]

Why could VE not become the energy supplier for Shetland,providing electricty,coal,gas and oil at non or next to non profitable prices for everyone living on these islands .

 

As long as they did not make a loss and a very modest profit this would surely be of benifit to us all. 

 

Instead of paying our bills to companys like SSE and local companys we would pay VE thus lining our own pockets and not those of others!

Couldn't agree more Urabug, if the big companies can sell their electricity at cheaper prices to the central belt and charge us a lot more, then VE surely can set their tariffs to reverse the norm and charge cheaper electric to rural areas.

[Middlin]

Anyhow they already stated that we wouldn't get cheap power as we'd only waste it.

Yeh, me thinks this was the biggest cop out I'd heard for a while. Give us cheaper electric and we will all live in overheated houses with all our windows open to cool them down. What planet are these people living on?

 

Cheaper electric would help equalise the hiked charges we already pay to the heartless companies, who, when costs adjust, put up prices at the drop of a hat, yet take years to bring them down. They pay the decision makers millions per year, whilst our old and disabled struggle to heat their homes.

It would also help recognise the additional cost we in Shetland face, due to the lower temperatures and wind chill.

[paulb]

probably best system to achieve local supply would be a scattering of medium sized farms tied in with a solar and hydro system. we would need to take over the supply system as well im guessing it would cost a fair bit to buy and upgrade. we do need to consider a community owed oil system to fund reduced cost heating fuel/petrol. as far as im aware the sic cant be involved in power supply. just remember you need any system to make profit. you can operate at cost because it would not fund future improvements. a local carbon tax could assist in funding improvements.