Shetland windfarm - Viking Energy

[Njugle]

It would seem that the majority are in support of it in principle

 

"Shetland supports windfarm" from Shetland News

 

Councillor Ratter would do well to continue to tread carefully on this and not turn it into a crusade in my opinion. I'd be surprised if i was alone in saying it should not be all or nothing, and done in stages.

 

Of the 502 surveyed i wonder if my Granny was counted. She got extremely angry and suspicious that someone called her more than once about some "environmental nonsense" and called me to vent that it might be a seriously dodgy character sussing her out and that if they called again she was going to call the police. It took me 20 minutes to calm her down, well she is almost ninety. I don't suppose there are many 90 year olds that would fully grasp what the survey was supposed to be about.

Thank god they didn't call again.

"Viking Energy in phone harassment trial"

 

Ahem, anyway..........

[ArabiaTerra]

It is surprising that there is no organised opposition to this project, or is it a fact that the majority are in favour?

 

http://www.shetland-news.co.uk/pages/news%20stories/12_2006/survey_shetland_supports_windfarm.htm

 

It seems that the majority supports the windygens.

 

If the transmission of electricity via cable over very long distances isn't efficient, why not copy the PURE idea of using the wind powered generators to produce hydrogen.

 

Has this idea been seriously considered? It seems like a way to nicely sidestep the quoted £1 billion cost of the interconnector. Just build a hydrogen powered power station and some storage on the Firth of Forth near the existing oil terminal and hook that to the grid. A couple of shuttle tankers could run between Sullom and the Forth. In addition, the resulting Hydrogen could be sold directly as fuel for vehicles. Surely all this could be done for less than a billion?

 

It would also cover any variability in the supply of wind which seems to be the major arguemant against windfarms at the mo'.

[Sudden Stop]

I did suggest it on one of those surveys viking energy sent around ages ago, and full credit to them, in the reply they did say that the option had been identified, but that the hydrogen production in Unst is small scale so a direct comparison is hard.

 

Once hydrogen production moves up in scale, to fuel peoples homes and there are more fuel cell cars on the road then i think the idea would be jumped at. This is a long way off at the moment. You need hydrogen production to already be large scale before people will use it in their homes but you need to have the large domestic market before the production will be started. Nobody is going to invest large amounts of money to set it all up, only to end up storing the stuff for years. Catch 22 isn't it.

 

A power station running on hydrogen? It is an idea, but it would probably be expensive to build (again because the technology on that scale isn't widespread).

 

The hydrogen option is something for the future imho but the council want to build a windfarm now don't they? Which'll mean a big feckin' cable....

[Styumpie]

What do the people of Shetland stand to gain from this monstrous project?

 

As far as I can see, very little. I think we should be looking at using OUR council money, to fund a wind farm to power Shetland residents and business ONLY. If this is successful, and us, the people of Shetland can get very cheap power, it will be a success and our economy will thrive. It will make the cost of living a bit cheaper and inline with the rest of the UK. Money well spent, which is WHAT WE WANT.

 

This project will probably fail in the long run leaving Shetland in a real mess, its seems the losers will be the large amount people who rely on the tourist industry. The winners (if they are lucky and the project actually makes a profit) will be the main share holders of the project, who, no matter what they say, probably dont care about you. Us, the people of Shetland will probably be worse off, our land will be butchered up by a vast sea of monstrous turbines.

 

I think we need to be able to walk before we can run, and this project is far far far to risky.

 

We need to stop this happening in my opinion, before it is too late. We cannot afford to let this happen, The people with Vested Interests will try and shine a good light on this project, but please try and look at the facts, and decide based on what this project will give to you/us.

 

I am very much in favour of renewable energy, using it to boost our economy and develop it over the coming years to fit the market, then expand and make profit for us, not just a few share holders with the desire to be rich.

 

I think if there is such a project, it should be funded by shareholders, to qualify to be a share holder you must be a resident of Shetland so everyone can have a stake in it. The whole thing should have an elected management team and major decisions should be made by a shareholder vote.

[MuckleJoannie]

I think we should be looking at using OUR council money, to fund a wind farm to power Shetland residents and business ONLY..

 

This is already has been done at Burradale. A large part of its orginal capital was provided by SLAP, which sold it to the Shetland development Trust. The SDT recently received a handsome dividend. The 5 windmills there are as many as the local system can handle. Yell has a proposal for a small community windfarm for the Northern Isles.

 

This project will probably fail in the long run leaving Shetland in a real mess, its seems the losers will be the large amount people who rely on the tourist industry

 

This is my fear. I regularly used to hear from the manager of the District Heating Scheme that wind generation was yesterday's technology. The Dane's pioneered wind farms, then discoverd that they did not cut the amount of convential power stations. I think that the SIC would be far better investing in wave or tidal power.

 

The winners (if they are lucky and the project actually makes a profit) will be the main share holders of the project, who, no matter what they say, probably dont care about you. Us, the people of Shetland will probably be worse off, our land will be butchered up by a vast sea of monstrous turbines.

 

I think we need to be able to walk before we can run, and this project is far far far to risky.

 

We need to stop this happening in my opinion, before it is too late. We cannot afford to let this happen, The people with Vested Interests will try and shine a good light on this project, but please try and look at the facts, and decide based on what this project will give to you/us.

 

I am very much in favour of renewable energy, using it to boost our economy and develop it over the coming years to fit the market, then expand and make profit for us, not just a few share holders with the desire to be rich.

 

I think if there is such a project, it should be funded by shareholders, to qualify to be a share holder you must be a resident of Shetland so everyone can have a stake in it. The whole thing should have an elected management team and major decisions should be made by a shareholder vote.

 

The Viking Energy website says "in September 2003 the Council at that time decided to apply staff and financial resources as and when required to support the proposal for the Shetland community to become a developer itself (with partners or alone) and advance a community owned, community controlled development to maximise community benefit....In July 2006 Viking Energy Ltd and SSE Generation Ltd (a subsidiary of Scottish and Southern Energy plc) signed a Memorandum of Understanding strengthening both sides by committing to work to join the separate projects into a single venture. " This is our council using our money. It says it will be for our benefit but I hae my doots.

 

A parallel could be drawn with Sullom Voe in terms of the community benefit. However then the oil industry needed Shetland but Shetland did not want the oil industry so it could dictate terms. This time we are trying to jump on a bandwagon.

[Sudden Stop]

This project will probably fail in the long run leaving Shetland in a real mess, its seems the losers will be the large amount people who rely on the tourist industry........ Shetland will probably be worse off, our land will be butchered up by a vast sea of monstrous turbines.

 

To say that the project will probably fail is a bit harsh, if anywhere is going to make a success of a windfarm - it'll be Shetland. We have a good history of making big industry behave itself. The massive oil terminal nestled in sullom voe must overall be seen as a good thing for Shetland and despite to obvious danges to wildlife and tourism hasn't caused any major direct problems. When the terminal finishes and we aren't getting anything from it, the whole thing has to be removed.

 

Now, say they do build the windfarm, and for arguements sake, it does fail somehow, what it going to be easier to remove? A wind generator and it's concrete foundations or a MASSIVE oil storage tank or a gas power station, frac towers, processing plants, waste water treatment plants etc. In my view the wind generator are very unlikely to butcher anything.

 

The scale of the project does seem to be the biggest worry. One generator and associated foundations is not going to destory windlife habitats and scare off the tourists. Two or three or ten probably won't either, but when you start to talk about hundreds of them people get worried. Each unit, taken by itself, isn't a problem - you can unbolt the tower and dig up the concrete. If you want to jump up and down about butchering landscape - think about things like the Sullom mine and the people that wanted to quarry the hill and ship the stone to Europe. How do you undo that afterwards???

 

What we have to do is make sure we have control over how it's all handled. Make sure there are clauses that ensure the ground is return to it's original state in the event of failure fo the project. Bury the transmission cables, demand landscaping of any disturbed lands. Get them to plant a forest around the towers!! Surely it can be done as simpathically as possible - if we demand it.

 

Broadly, i am in favour of the windfarm, provided Shetland profits from it and not some faceless company or a few individuals. I told Viking energy in their survey that i would like some of any potential profits used to develope tidal energy production - it never fails, two tides a day, everyday! Yell sound or Bluemull sound are perfect candidates...

[islandhopper]

... I regularly used to hear from the manager of the District Heating Scheme that wind generation was yesterday's technology. The Dane's pioneered wind farms, then discoverd that they did not cut the amount of convential power stations. I think that the SIC would be far better investing in wave or tidal power.

 

@MuckleJoannie:

That's right. Here on the continent, wind farms are a "dieing" industry (for various reasons and that's just why the "pioneers" from Danmark and Germany are more and more looking for remote areas outside their countries, where they will not face stronger protests by the public and more and more rstictions by gevernmental bodies and courts.

 

In my view the wind generator are very unlikely to butcher anything.

 

I am not that sure, Sudden Stop! I'm not a botanist or an ecologist either. But I saw the trucks bringing the modules for the generators via accessroads to the site. Here in my neighbourhood it is absolutely no problem, simply due to the fact that none of such a "road" is longer than 300m deverting from the next mainroad capable of a 60to truck. I really don't know what will happen to the sensible moorlands and heathers if they are once cut down to the solid rocks and the rocks once levelled so that trucks up to 50 to 60to will be able to go up to the actual positions in the Kames and around there. I'm simply afraid that some squarekilometres of natural environment will be destroyed and that it will take some decades that "nature" will win back the bare rocks.

 

As I understoods the Scottish newspapers that was one of the major reasons why AL Fayed's plans for a similar development in Sutherland were just stopped at the very last minute some days before Christmas.

[Guest Anonymous]

should tthey maybe thin abpout putting dis windmills in da sooth mainland, on da sight where da radar dishes used tae sit , ders alreadyy roads up there and its closer to whar the want to export the electric to? but also the should realy be putting them offshore , the technology exists.

[JustMe]

Sudden Stop wrote

Broadly, i am in favour of the windfarm, provided Shetland profits from it and not some faceless company or a few individuals. I told Viking energy in their survey that i would like some of any potential profits used to develop tidal energy production - it never fails, two tides a day, everyday! Yell sound or Bluemull sound are perfect candidates...

 

Which highlights the main problem with wind powered generators.....they cannot provide a consistent supply of electricity by themselves. Unless an interconnector is laid between Shetland and the UK mainland the power station will need to be kept ready to be fired up if the wind drops. Then again perhaps it will always need to be kept ready to cover for breaks in the cable.

[DavidThomson]

I try not to comment as I am involved with the project but in case there is any confusion:

 

What do the people of Shetland stand to gain from this monstrous project?

 

The winners (if they are lucky and the project actually makes a profit) will be the main share holders of the project, who, no matter what they say, probably dont care about you. Us, the people of Shetland will probably be worse off, our land will be butchered up by a vast sea of monstrous turbines.

 

The people with Vested Interests will try and shine a good light on this project, but please try and look at the facts, and decide based on what this project will give to you/us.

 

I think if there is such a project, it should be funded by shareholders, to qualify to be a share holder you must be a resident of Shetland so everyone can have a stake in it. The whole thing should have an elected management team and major decisions should be made by a shareholder vote.

 

The main shareholders of this project will be the rate-payers of Shetland. Please go to the Viking Energy website where the link to the Shetland Islands Council is explained. The whole intent of this project is for it to be for the benefit of Shetland’s economy.

 

As far as I can see, very little. I think we should be looking at using OUR council money, to fund a wind farm to power Shetland residents and business ONLY. If this is successful, and us, the people of Shetland can get very cheap power, it will be a success and our economy will thrive. It will make the cost of living a bit cheaper and inline with the rest of the UK. Money well spent, which is WHAT WE WANT.

 

I personally do not agree with statement. It might initially seem lovely to have cheap/free electricity but in my opinion it is irresponsible. Regardless of whether you believe in global warming or not it is difficult to make a strong argument that we should undertake actions that will encourage the waste of energy. Cheap or free electricity will encourage waste. Why bother insulating houses when you could just turn up the heating and warm up your home with no extra/significant cost? Never mind that you would mainly be warming the air above your house more. Electricity, regardless of how it is generated, should be conserved wherever possible.

That said, by building indigenous (to the UK) power stations that will not be dependent on intercontinental fuel transfers, this type of project should protect us from wild price hikes as has been experienced recently.

[Sudden Stop]

Money raised from the oil industry has been spent on various projects around shetland, look at all the leisure centres. If the charitable trust had a new income (from the windfarm), and since we don't need any more leisure centres, insulating everybodys homes would be a good start. I agree that very cheap or free electricity would encourage waste but i think there could be other ways to put money in our pockets. I don't suggest we get payments for having the generators on our island, but subsidising island life would good. We have an oil terminal and yet still some of the most expensive fuel in the country! How did that happen? Bringing living costs down a bit would be welcome!

[DavidThomson]

Money raised from the oil industry has been spent on various projects around shetland, look at all the leisure centres. If the charitable trust had a new income (from the windfarm), and since we don't need any more leisure centres, insulating everybodys homes would be a good start. I agree that very cheap or free electricity would encourage waste but i think there could be other ways to put money in our pockets. I don't suggest we get payments for having the generators on our island, but subsidising island life would good. We have an oil terminal and yet still some of the most expensive fuel in the country! How did that happen? Bringing living costs down a bit would be welcome!

 

The Viking Energy website sets out what the intentions are regarding the promotion of energy conservation etc (and insulating homes is top of the list). This also includes investment into research of the next generation of technologies (wave, tidal and storage) but are there any other suggestions as how to realistically use the funds to make life better?

For the sake of argument, we'll take a strict line about the use of the word realistic and reject "give everyone something for free" ideas.

[Sudden Stop]

The charitable and amenity trusts should have agendas for projects which help the community and provided monies aren't wasted on anymore forgien ferry companies or other ridiculous things, i'm happy to leave it to them. What I would like to see though, is a Trust that isn't full of serving council members trying to fund their pet projects.

 

Communications are something high on my personal list, having good reliable phone lines, good internet speeds and half decent tv signal would reduce some of the swearing in my houshold! Fixed links to the isles would be good, waiting for ferries and then not getting onboard because they are full is very tedious. Tunnels are preferable to bridges, but that's an arguement for a different thread.

 

Ensuring that there is sustainable industry to keep jobs on the island is important and new ventures should be financally backed wherever possible, but no more flamin' fish farms please! If people are worried about tourists not coming to visit because of the look of a windfarm should remember that nearly every voe has a fish or mussle farm in it. Those are an eyesore and that hasn't put off the tourists.

[Pooks]

Nice bunch of photos here -->

 

http://thrillingwonder.blogspot.com/2007/01/wind-power-in-stormy-waters.html

 

All about offshore wind farms.

[Twerto]

Dont tell the harbor trust about these.. they might just start whining.

 

they could do something liek this off the nw coast papa stour imo