Shoogler

^^ Simple thing to phone the Mareel management and ask rather than waste time debating here

No thanks. Edit: They wouldn't go amiss though with some "mystery shoppers" such as yourself perhaps though eh? Lost me there i'm afraid

Unlinked, with all your good ideas and input on the Mareel thread, i think you would be an asset to Shetland Arts and you should be looking for a job with them.....

Likewise with pubs offering a happy hour etc. Du kens da new licensing laws don't allow such a drinks promotion anymore - agree with the essence of what Symbister is saying however

this is interesting for comparative cost purposes - however, the private sector is just that. It is paid for privately, not out of the public purse. Unless you are suggesting that people in Shetland pay for a school to stay open then I am not sure why you are using this analogy. The only way to drop down the cost of delivering education in Shetland is to reduce the staff levels and/or find a cheaper delivery method (using technology of whatever kind). On top of that, the next bigg cost is the buildings themselves - so a few less is the way to go.

^^ Who are'they' and what do you mean?

If even £1 was charged it would begin to cover some costs - and wouldn't detract from visitor numbers

^^^ whart do you mean when you say'other funds invested in the housing account'? Are you talking about Reserve funds or Disturbance payments form when they existed?

^^^ Agree - how can you have an allowance for 'sick days'? Pretty sure that's not what applies in local government.

^^^ Indeed.......

Of course its about money Trowie. When you say 'other options', do you mean other than the education budget or other ways of 'sharing' out the education budget? If the SIC is spending 30% more than it gets in central government funding and the education budget is the biggest part of that how can you ignore it?

I know of many good honest hard working Icelandic people who have lost everything and are destitute as a result of the banking collapse. No idea what you are saying really, as the Icelanders backed their banks big time and the whole nation had a stake to an extent

^^ ..and a slate tile roof in keeping with the Conservation Area under which planning permission was given. How have they managed to get round planning and building regs in such a way? II are you a Scalloway resident or just a stirrer?

^^ That is what amounts to threatening behaviour Paul - Mods over to you You're not on

Its a pity this thread has descended into a bit of a scatter gun slanging match in the main. I hear a lot about how SIC should leave schools alone/shut Lerwick schools, but what is really needed is alternative ideas to what has been proposed, not just knee jerk anti town bile.

This attitude actually really annoys me. I think what Shoogler was meaning was that the cuts are coming regardless, the council have made this very clear, and in some areas they'll be hard hitting. Picking holes in the proposals won't mean they'll abandon the proposals - they no longer have the money to dither for another few years. It's therefore better to be part of the solution and to have some say in the future shape of local education. But I think if people would like to retain all the existing schools, the solutions will need to be quite radical. I appreciate what Trowie is saying and i am not saying individuals or communities should do the job of councillors and council directors. What I am saying is that if the SIC is not going to cut the education budget (which is by far the biggest piece of the pie) there needs to be a groundswell to stop spending on other things. I do agree that a laypersons guide to council budgets is necessary, but the way I see it right now if we don't make some level of cut in education we will have to make substantially greater cuts in other services. So, right now we are being faced with cuts to ferries and buses and winter gritting, all of wghich cost a small fraction of what education is spending. Do we cut these areas by 2 or 3 times as much to save on an expensive standard of education? Do we depopulate our smallest islands to save money?

It would be very productive if folk on this thread would give an idea of how they would like SIC to make the same level of savings in other ways. Then the SIC could be challenged to come up with costs for such proposals and it may force councillors to consider any alternatives. I heard on radio Shetland that SIC had admitted a typo in the figures for Uyeasound, but even with that corrected they still made a bigger saving (on paper) than originally thought.

If you look at the figures you will see that she was quoting the total cost of Secondary and Primary. The saving to be made is from discontinuing the secondary school and hence the new cost is £920K Re transport - obviously transport costs are indicative only and that will need to be firmed up on during the consultation process - depends, could be if a new contractor but that sort of thing is capitalised over many years like in any other business Re Mike Russell - and it is refreshing that Councillors are being honest about the drivers for change, and that doesn't mean a lessening of the standard of education Re 'equality/Human rights Holy C i've heard it all now! Human Rights issues are you having a laugh? If you live that far away then the option is boarding at the hostel. The other option is a more direct travel route for any child over 65 minutes away, i.e. not part of a multiple pick up/feeder route

Read the whole document and appendices - carefully - and not selectively Paul and stop cherrypicking numbers to suit your theory. The cost per pupil for AHS is £6,600 and this would reduce if more bairns are there in (some) larger classes. You are correct they haven't factored in the ultimate transport cost for every scenario but my understanding is they have gone to the existing transport operators and got a fair estimate Cost of transport as a proportion of overall Childrens Services budgets is only 6% so it can easily go up to 7 or 8% and still the savings are worth it

As i said above, they could lay on taxi's for bairns over 1 hour away and still make a saving. They could also do away with the entire 'Directorate' cost in the service and this would still leave the SIC short of the target by about 2.5 million. There is no proposal to do away with Mid Yell - only to transfer Baltasound JHS. This one appears to me the most difficult to see 'alternative' transport arrangements, unless we are speaking about SIC opening up Unst airport and using helicopters!!

^^ Transport and hosteling costs are towards the back of the second doc - appendix 1 For Aith = extra transport £114,000 and hosteling costs are £2,740 Even with these costs there is a proposed saving of £715,000 You need to read the whole thing in some detail to get a chance of understanding the costs - not easy i know.

There is a costing for extra transport and also an estimate of hostelling for a specific number of bairns in the Aith catchment area. There is also an acknowledgement that existing transport routes will mean some bairns can't get to school in under the 'maximum' time of 65 minutes and that alternative means will be explored. I think you can safely say that these bairns will be practically taxied to school in Lerwick and back and that will still be a huge saving on the current cost model - either that or they will be deemed to be hostel kids.

^^^ What's FTTP?

This is a pretty detailed breakdown of the current costs of running each school and the way in which ALL costs are allocated,including central and 'overhead' charges. I am stunned at just how much we are paying for certain schools and nurseries - no wonder we are in the mess we are in as we have allowed this to go unchecked for far too long and we simply can't afford to let it continue. It seems to me that if SIC don't back a radical change and take action to deliver education in a different and cheaper way, then we will have an even bigger disaster to sort out in a few more years. The pain of having to accept a different model of schooling is going to have to be accepted throughout Shetland

^^ Interesting but where do you get this stuff from peat? Is it on the councils website?