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School closures

sic school closures

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220 replies to this topic

#31 shetlandpeat

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Posted 27 May 2013 - 11:13 PM

Of course, point out the obvious. You will find that if a member of a union wants the union to be involved, then they are. As there has already been collective bargaining, there is no reason why it should not continue. Any sensible employer will work with unions.

As for your rhetoric about unions, I am not surprised. You are spouting stuff you appear to know little about, we all know unions are not in charge, they do however protect their members the best they can. Legislation put in by Thatcher has seen to that. The unions do far more than you would like folk to think.

I think it is also great that small minded people oust those who think they have great ideas, or even been part of an event. I know, abusing your quote, bad me...

Now den, seriously are you taking it?

#32 Ghostrider

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 02:13 AM

There are some things we do agree on, not that I would think that that is wrong. Sadly, you do, perhaps. Alas, that could be for a number of reasons, though, I will not speculate.


Peat, it was an attempt at levity.

Putting a pre-requisite on who can and cannot have an opinion sounds quite wrong. Regardless of where I live or how many times I visit, I still have an interest. I share it here, on this site used by a very small number of similar folk, who have an interest, apart from purveying second hand goods or other services. Yet, to have a go at my opinions because I have a go at yours, then to complain about it, is slightly amusing. Alas, these are my opinions. Had you read my post, you would see what I was getting at. Seriously, not to withstand the lecture every time I post something that does not conform, this is really just a sounding board for some, and of course a means of communication. I am surprised you go at the lengths you do to chastise folk sometimes. That however, is your prerogative. To reply how I see fit, surely is mine.


Wear the cap if it fits, if you must, but I put no pre-requisite for anything on anyone having an opinion. I was simply pointing out, that as a non-resident and occasional short term visitor, your opinion is based in considerably less knowledge and information of the situation than those living in its midst 24/7/365 and may also be somewhat skewed.

#33 concerned shetlander

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 07:35 AM

I see that what nobody mentions is that in the secondary schools like Aith or Sandwick, we are not talking about small schools, because the number they intend to move is about 100 hundred pupils per school. You cannot say that it is a small unviable number of pupils. It also has better Standard grades results in Aith compared to the Anderson High, so it seems quite stupid to put them to Lerwick for a lesser education plus the longer travelling and of course the children from the farthest away areas having maybe to stay in a hostel all week, which is not good for family life. How can they say that keeping children in a hostel can be cheaper as keeping them at home at their own schools before they pay for building of hostels plus the staff needed to look after them.[/url]

#34 shetlander

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 07:52 AM

I imagine the head teachers and also class teachers who have permanent contracts will be offered redundancy packages. Anyone on a temporary contract will be up the creek without a paddle once their contract runs out and the jobs run out.

I understood that Sandwick JH asked for their consultation to be brought forward so they got a chance of the jobs.

But the dept doesn't close until the new AHS is built. So how does that work? Or have I got that wrong?


I think it was only the consultation on the closure of Sandwick Secondary that was brought forward, not the proposed closure date. So that would still only happen when the new AHS is completed.

I’ve seen very few school jobs advertised externally lately and presume that any vacancies are either not being filled or are being filled on a temporary/supply/relief basis. If and when schools are closed, permanent staff are presumably first offered posts in other schools being held by temporary employees (who unfortunately lose out) before being offered redundancy?

#35 trowie246

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 08:05 AM

I see that what nobody mentions is that in the secondary schools like Aith or Sandwick, we are not talking about small schools, because the number they intend to move is about 100 hundred pupils per school.


You are right. And this was about the number at Scalloway. The quantity of pupils being moved didn't stop them closing Scalloway secondary dept.

The main thing Aith and Sandwick have as an argument against closure is the distance involved. It is absolutely ridiculous to be moving over a hundred pupils, some 25 miles or more away from Lerwick by bus just to get to school.

#36 trowie246

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 08:36 AM

I also have some concerns about how they are going to try and 'reduce' the travel times, at least on paper.

Does anyone know how the designated pick up points for the school bus will work in practice?

Presumably it is to reduce travel times, so the bus which used to stop on route and pick up your bairn no longer stops (within the 3 miles or whatever it is) So your child has to be driven or walk to the bus.

So does that mean that on the return journey a bairn could actually pass by their house in the bus and then have to walk back?

#37 paulb

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 10:30 AM

at a guess yes thats what they will do. after all those extra 3 miles either way just wont count on travel time.

be assured that this plan was on the drawing board well before the council discovered it was broke.

they were always planning on building double what the Anderson needed.

this comment that the council will have to borrow the 12 million thats their share and they dont think they can afford it. how were they planning to pay the 40 odd million of the original plans.

yet these experts had never thought about asking the Scottish government for help.

does that tell you how competent these managers are.

i wonder what other projects have been funded locally that could have been centrally funded. and how much that has cost us.

#38 Silvercloud

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 10:54 AM

So what can you do about a council that wants to centralise whatever it can including education ?

I understand Sandwick brought their consultation forward so the doubt of will it won't it close didn't drag on.

#39 paulb

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 11:48 AM

well after all there mess ups in the past has anyone been sacked ever. are we allowed to recall a councillor to the election box for lying to the public.

#40 trowie246

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 12:47 PM

at a guess yes thats what they will do. after all those extra 3 miles either way just wont count on travel time.


It's a pretty sneaky thing to try to do, at best inconvenient for parents and at worst dangerous and unpleasant for bairns who may have to walk up to 3 miles on a dark, wet and windy winter night on a single track road with very little verges.

No matter what they try and say the travel time is from when the bairn leaves the house and that can not be changed. I sincerely hope our councillors can figure that out for themselves. They may in fact be making the journey longer for some bairns who normally were picked up from their door by making them travel to the pick up point.

#41 Silvercloud

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 01:42 PM

I suppose they will do what other areas in the UK do pick up and drop off at certain points then if child has to walk 3 miles in whatever direction home so be it .This is what happened to my family living in rural area with different dangers /hazzards , I fear it will be worse for some children walking to and from the bus points her .
Then the council sneakily few years later started charging the parents for the transport costs with quite number of families having large bills of a few hundred plus a year which at the time we were told know this won't happen but it did .
Give it time rest assured I bet this won't be far off their hidden agenda for charging parents the costs. Heard it all before sadly.
I chose to move to an area where my children for much of their education can walk safely to from school from nursery - highs school - not then to find out certain schools maybe closing .
Frustrating with underhand tatics at play or hidden agendas, I suppose it will come out in the wash but probably at significant cost to local communities if anymore centrlisation continues.

#42 paulb

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 03:02 PM

just had a letter from school. the nursery class will mainly be taught as of next year by none teachers. ok the folks they are replacing them with have nice sounding titles but really they are class room assistants. i know from when our children were in nursery school how important that education was. its a lot more than playgroups and a bit of teaching. it set my kids up for there school lifes.

anyone else noticed the music tuition is going from 1 to 1 to groups yet the price is remaining the same.

its really going to be a death by cuts.

again those behind the re re re think of the blueprint are they prepared to go if there plans fail to make the savings they claim.

that is without them fixing the figures.

#43 unlinkedstudent

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 04:40 PM

just had a letter from school. the nursery class will mainly be taught as of next year by none teachers. ok the folks they are replacing them with have nice sounding titles but really they are class room assistants. i know from when our children were in nursery school how important that education was. its a lot more than playgroups and a bit of teaching. it set my kids up for there school lifes.

anyone else noticed the music tuition is going from 1 to 1 to groups yet the price is remaining the same.

its really going to be a death by cuts.

again those behind the re re re think of the blueprint are they prepared to go if there plans fail to make the savings they claim.

that is without them fixing the figures.


Many countries around the world don't start education until a child is around 6, some even later. I have no problems whatsoever with a classroom assistant leading a pre-school class; in fact, amazed they haven't earlier. Years ago, attending nursery school before infants school was basically a glorified babysitting service - and what has changed now, apart from the fact they have put things like "must play with water, must play with sand" onto the curriculum? Starting school early doesn't necessarily equate to good, basic reading, writing and mathematical skills.

Re the fees for musical instrument tuition - guess they trying to meet demand and at the same time bring in some pennies although I hasten to add it wouldn't hurt to reduce the fees.

#44 trowie246

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 04:57 PM

I suppose they will do what other areas in the UK do pick up and drop off at certain points then if child has to walk 3 miles in whatever direction home so be it .This is what happened to my family living in rural area with different dangers /hazzards , I fear it will be worse for some children walking to and from the bus points her .


I fear it will be worse here in Shetland as well. We have very little light on a winter morning and it will be dark when the bairns get home from school. Never mind the hellish wind and rain we can have.

The charging for school transport might happen faster than you think. The Infrastructure dept have apparantly told councillors that if school transport costs increases then they will reduce public transport to pay for it.

#45 humptygrumpty

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 05:44 PM

I thought it had been proven to councillors that the time taken to bus the bairns to Lerwick was longer than their "policy" allowed ? Or will that "policy" just be changed to suit the sic ?

And at what cost will having such a network of buses ?

It seemed that any suggestions about reopening the Scalloway secondary and busing bairns out of Lerwick was poo pooed big time , no surprises there. Whatever happens must happen in lerwick.

Its only maybe 3 yrs ago we all attended The so called "blueprint" for education meetings at the Aith school and not one mention was made then of a definate closure programme.......it appears now that that was all stoness and this has been on the cards for a long time. Just goes to show , as if any more proof were needed that the sic are simply not to be trusted. :evil:





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