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Culture Strategy for Scotland consultation

culture scottish government

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#16 Capeesh

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Posted 08 September 2018 - 09:04 PM

@suffererof1crankymofo
The document in the link provided by peeriebryan says it hopes to achieve this by...
• Making sure people have a say in the type of culture that’s available in their communities.
• Promoting different types of culture.
• Creating partnerships between culture organisations, businesses and people.

"Recognised by whom?"

I'm assuming they mean that it's important for the people developing the culture plan to recognise that a one size fits all culture is not what their aim is, hence making it one of their 3 aims

Edited by Capeesh, 08 September 2018 - 09:06 PM.


#17 Suffererof1crankymofo

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Posted 08 September 2018 - 09:12 PM

@ Capeesh

 

I don't think it's any of my neighbour's (and ergo, my local community's) business if myself and a few mates participate in ballet or any other cultural activity that's available in our locality.  If a few folk want to get together and have an accordion club, provided no noise nuisance/laws are being broken, what the hell has it got to do with the government or anyone else?  I also don't think it's the government's business to be promoting them.  I don't think it's down to them either to create partnerships between culture organisations, businesses and people.

 

In other words, I wish they would keep their dictatorial beaks out!


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#18 Ghostrider

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Posted 08 September 2018 - 09:46 PM

One of the 3 aims of the Scottish government's culture plan is...
Quote...

"To make sure each community is recognised as having its own culture and sense of identity."

Blows the predictable tinfoil hat brigade theories mentioned above out of the water.

 

No it doesn't.

 

Firstly, governments, and the Holyrood one no less so than others, are great at saying things, but when it come sto actually delivering on them, half-heartedly, reluctantly and eventually are the order of the day. Cheaper ferry fares and still trying, and failing to sort out a 3+ year old mess of their own making to pay agricultural subsidies being two prime examples.

 

Secondly, culture is led by individuals first more often than not, and only communities by default secondly. Fiddle playing and fiddle tunes are held in some regard in Shetland culture, some communities in the past were 'lucky' in having several talented and willing fiddle players, others were lucky if they had one, who as often as not had to be persuaded (bribed) to travel some considerable distance and then constantly persuaded (bribed)  throughout the night to continue playing. Were it not for those few individuals, there would be no Shetland-wide fiddle culture of today, it would be a culture of a few select localised geographical areas, just like UHA was until relatively recently a "culture" almost exclusive to the toon.

 

To concentrate on the "community" aspect of culture only is to stifle the very thing that creates culture, and makes it evolve and grow. The contribution of the one individual in some way that in time spreads through a community either causing a previous 'culture' to evolve in to something different, or creating something entirely new. Certainly something needs to be reasonably widespread throughout a community to be accept as a 'culture', but to only address the 'cultures' that currently exist within a community is going to do more to slow down and stagnate the natural progressions and evolutions 'cultures' by default continously go through that keeps that popular, current and vibrant, than do anything else.

 

Just look at where the mainstream music industry has ended up as a result of being controlled by the bottom line driven strategies and policies of a few industry behemoths. Any government strategy, however well intentioned will inevitably have a similar effect on 'culture' for the simple reason it is people from outside of 'culture', who have very limited ir any understanding and appreciation for the subject they are making decisions on. If 'culture' would benefit from any kind of national 'strategy', the initiative and details of it need to be from those involved in 'culture' on a continous basis, who understand it and appreciate it. From the bottom up so to speak, not largely dictated from the top down as is suggested here.

 

This is a Holyrood initiative, and from the contents of their document it seems they have already made a number of decisions and reached a number of conclusions, and are only now soliciting comment. Comment, which they may or may not heed at their own whim. That's wholly ass about udder for creating relevant and beneficial 'strategy', the initiative and realities need to come from within 'culture', and then if government involvement is desired, the government approached for comment.

 

Its a 'we know whats good for your culture, better than you know your culture yourself' exercise in the making as it stands.

 

Nothing necessariy wrong with the concept of a 'culture' strategy in and of itself, its just being punted by the wrong people in entirely the wrong way.


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#19 Ghostrider

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Posted 08 September 2018 - 09:55 PM

@ Ghostrider - I've decided it's culture when I practice doing ballet in the kitchen.

 

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Edited by Ghostrider, 08 September 2018 - 09:55 PM.

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#20 Ghostrider

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Posted 08 September 2018 - 10:15 PM

Somewhat off the subject I am also pleased to see the use of the phrase "cacque handed". A phrase I was brought up with but whenever I've used it in more recent years no one seems to understand it.

 

Maybe an age thing. :???:  Certainly one I've used, and heard used often going back a good way.

 

I was sure it used to be spelled 'cacque' and all, so its good to see someone else using that. As when I figured I'd best check I was remembering the spelling right, google was giving nothing for 'cacque', and all the hits were coming back for 'cack' - Which to me is the slang version, used by folk who can't spell properly in the first place.



#21 The Cleaner

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Posted 08 September 2018 - 10:47 PM

I have to confess I wasn't sure of the spelling so went with the way you spelt it! The meaning I know is to be heavy handed (literally or theoretically,is that the word I'm looking for?!), clumsy or awkward. I think it is a 50+ sort of expression right enough.

#22 George.

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Posted 08 September 2018 - 10:59 PM

The majority of people appear to spell it, "Cack handed" or so it appears. https://en.oxforddic...ion/cack-handed

 

Right, time for a cuppa B)


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#23 mikeyboy

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Posted 09 September 2018 - 05:44 AM

 

Somewhat off the subject I am also pleased to see the use of the phrase "cacque handed". A phrase I was brought up with but whenever I've used it in more recent years no one seems to understand it.

 

Maybe an age thing. :???:  Certainly one I've used, and heard used often going back a good way.

 

I was sure it used to be spelled 'cacque' and all, so its good to see someone else using that. As when I figured I'd best check I was remembering the spelling right, google was giving nothing for 'cacque', and all the hits were coming back for 'cack' - Which to me is the slang version, used by folk who can't spell properly in the first place.

 

 

 

No as far as I am aware always cack handed. Being one of those words that came to Britain through the army in the Middle East where people wipe their bums with their Left hand and thus are cack handed.

But of course off topic so apologies.


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#24 Capeesh

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Posted 09 September 2018 - 05:47 AM

@ suffererof1crankymofo

Whatever floats your boat.

I personally see it as a positive thing, I hope that (on our behalf) the many superb groups, organisations and even interested individuals in Shetland participate.
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#25 The Cleaner

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Posted 09 September 2018 - 01:06 PM

I'm personally not against opportunities in any sort of creativity or sports/fitness being on offer, (they already are) & being advertised fully. My reservations are about how accessible they really will be to all. If you are on a very limited budget (& that's not necessarily unemployed) then even the extra bus fares to get to a venue (if it's not in walking distance) can be beyond your means. Yes even in Shetland there are some living this lean. Also ofcourse bus timetables don't always fit in with lessons or events, some areas are affected in this way worse than others. You may think a person can always get a lift but as a non driver I can tell you this simply isn't a reliable option, for work or play.
I have to say I don't have a great deal of faith in some involved in this partnership to deliver anything better than what's on offer at present. My scepticism stems from the things that have already taken place in relatively recent times such as the cutting/limiting of school knitting & musical instrument lessons that I mentioned in a previous post & other issues like "messing" with the timetable for the bowlers at the Clickamin. I wouldn't be surprised if there are other examples that I'm not aware of. Everything has a budget ofcourse but trimming from the roots is not the way to go about it & does not make me feel that opinions on what is wanted will be listened to seriously.
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#26 Suffererof1crankymofo

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Posted 09 September 2018 - 02:22 PM

@ Capeesh

 

It is one thing for a government to provide funding to the likes of Scottish Ballet, etc.  It's another thing entirely when they start to dictate upon what's available in areas and neighbourhoods having a say; that's what we already have planning laws for and a whole plethora of other organisations.  This whole thing reminds me of cultural activities such as those in Japan and China, whereby people must participate in certain activities, and not necessarily on a voluntary basis.  Having a greater say in what's available locally doesn't necessarily mean everyone will be in favour of certain cultural activities.

 

The document also refers to Scots language and gaelic; no mention of Shetland dialect; some might argue that it isn't Scottish.  So will all our roadsigns be in Gaelic then in the future?


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#27 George.

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Posted 09 September 2018 - 02:30 PM

It is one thing for a government to provide funding to the likes of Scottish Ballet, etc.  It's another thing entirely when they start to dictate upon what's available in areas and neighbourhoods having a say; that's what we already have planning laws for and a whole plethora of other organisations. 

Very Westminster.



#28 Urabug

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Posted 10 September 2018 - 10:40 AM

Immigration is influencing the British culture probably more than anything else,although TV ,Radio,mobile phones computers ect also have changed the way we live.   

 

Just walk down certain streets in say Birmingham for instance and you immediately think that you have been transported to  another country,the music,smell language ect.

 

Unfortunately "we" are now being pressured by political correctness to comply with certain aspects of this foreign culture by being restricted in what we can say and do.

 

Certain words and phrases ,jokes we used to tell will be seen as being racist or sexist ect 

 

No longer is a hymn sung at morning assembly at school,this was stopped years ago so as not to offend those of other religions .

 

I feel that we are all being "shaped" by our politicians to comply with this cultural change in Britain and those of us who object are labeled racist,sexist,homophobic ect ect.

 

Shetland culture has changed massively since my young days,some of it for the better,and some of it for the worse.

 

Freedom of speech and respect for our democracy will play an important role in how we maintain our culture.both in my opinion being seriously abused at this time. 


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#29 The Cleaner

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Posted 10 September 2018 - 12:35 PM

As far as the hymn singing at school morning assembly goes my own experience of this is such: I have attended three primary schools, the first (a regular non denominational) in London in a very multi cultural area where we had once a week assemblys with prayer & hymn singing. The other two schools here in Shetland, in the first the only nod to religion was the prayer said before eating our dinner, "for the food we are about to receive.....". The next school was similar to the London school but with the prayer at the dinner table too. Most of the time I was at this school my teacher was someone who said themselves that Christianity (particularly of the variety he followed) was his favourite subject & he shoe horned as much of it as possible into our school day starting with a morning prayer in class & bringing his religion into every subject if at all possible. This teacher was also the head of the school & he stopped us having the Up Helly Aa holiday because of it being a Pagan festival! As for the secondary school I attended here, it was the same as my first Shetland primary, just the usual prayer at the dinner table. In fact for at least the last year (of four) at this school a large plaque with this prayer scribed on it was displayed in our canteen & no praying was actually done verbally anymore. My schooling was from 1969 to 1980 to give you a timeline. Certainly my experience has been the amount of Christianity brought into the school day was tempered by practicality, smaller schools then didn't necessarily have room to hold an assembly. Going by what I've seen in Shetland, congregation numbers have fallen in many churches & some churches have been sold or are in use less frequently. Funnily enough I believe the Catholic churches congregation has increased some, in part because of eastern European immigrants. It seems to me that this part of our culture (Christianity) has changed because many have wanted it to or have lost interest in it for whatever reason/s. The people I know that are religious are more influenced by their family background than their schooling. Some may feel that religion & education shouldn't be mixed, but that's for another debate & thread.

#30 Urabug

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Posted 10 September 2018 - 01:55 PM

Yes The Cleaner--I'm not into religion but hymn singing was a cultural thing that was done in many schools until society changed it.

 

It was simply the principle of it, and  the old proverb "When in Rome do as the Romans do" comes to mind so why should we have to keep changing our ways to suit a small minority.


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