Brexit (merged threads)

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

Complaining about an extra 4 days of no parliament; oh, my heart bleeds.  Australia, Canada and other countries close down parliaments in the same way all the time and nobody bats an eyelid.  Add on a couple of days either side of being closed for party conference season and all hell breaks loose!

[Davie P]

Nah, trying to trivialise it as normal procedure isn't going to cut it. It's a PM trying to close down parliament to force through a constitutional agenda he doesn't have a majority for. We should all be concerned about that, regardless of our opinion on Brexit.

 

And it's a 5 week suspension, not 4 days. Even allowing for conference recess, this is unprecedented.

[Windwalker]

Whilst I’m not sure Boris should have taken this action, I wonder if parliament needs some kick up the backside to get on with Brexit.

 

The opposition and Labour in particular have been trying to get him out, suggesting votes of no confidence etc, with Corbin thinking he can take over, hows that democracy, the people didn’t vote either him or labour into power.

 

In my opinion British politics is in such a mess, we need to get on with Brexit and leave on the 31 Oct with or without a deal, otherwise we will be still in the same position in years to come. And I voted remain and don’t vote conservative. I’m of the opinion that if the uk would stick together the eu would give us the deal we need. At the moment they just have to sit back and let our parties destroy any prospects of an acceptable deal by their bickering with each other.

 

I’m sick to the back teeth of politics both in Westminster and Hollyrood. A large number of them are hypocrites. Nicola Sturgeon is on her soapbox, stating that democracy is dead, someone should tell her she killed off democracy the day she decided to blatantly ignore the outcome of the Scottish Independence referendum. Do they have no sense of decency.

 

I’ve had to switch the news off this morning as I can no longer listen to the crap coming out of the mouths of some of these politicians. What a bunch of greeting bairns. Ffs.

 

Rant over, normal service will resume shortly

Edited August 29, 2019 by Windwalker

[Wheelsup]

Ffs. That’s the first time I’ve felt uncomfortable going into the polling station. A bunch waving their wee flags at me. First time I’ve seen that in my parish. No need to tell you who their party is.

[Roachmill]

Ffs. That’s the first time I’ve felt uncomfortable going into the polling station. A bunch waving their wee flags at me. First time I’ve seen that in my parish. No need to tell you who their party is.

That's way OTT; even by current standards. The whole SNP overload will have done them some damage for sure. If you want the nation behind you then that has to come freely and not from constant badgering. It's enough to make one vote Labour 

[Urabug]

Lets remember that we have 650 MPs in parliament all on a salary of something like £76000 per year this totals to £49,400,000 lets ask ourselves is this value for money to let this group argue among themselves,getting nowhere , at the tax payers expense,and that not counting expenses.

 

Can you imagine any other organization operating in this way.

 

Would any of us hire a group of "work persons " to do a job all on say £25 an hour and allow them to stand around and argue amongst themselves all day at your own expense because that how I see our politicians.

 

Boris spoke about this country needing higher pay and productivity,well I do not see much productivity coming out of our houses of parliament.

 

Ma'be Boris has cracked the whip 

[Ghostrider]

 

Ffs. That’s the first time I’ve felt uncomfortable going into the polling station. A bunch waving their wee flags at me. First time I’ve seen that in my parish. No need to tell you who their party is.

That's way OTT; even by current standards. The whole SNP overload will have done them some damage for sure. If you want the nation behind you then that has to come freely and not from constant badgering. It's enough to make one vote Labour 

 

 

I'm just bracing myself for the onslaught of 'Not my MSP' greeting and whining if Wills doesn't top the ballot.

 

There's committed dedicated support, and there's obsessional blind obedience. This campaign has brought out an apparent worrysome level of the latter from one contender, and on principle alone, I cannot vote for anyone who can command that.

 

'Less is more' is maybe a bit of advice they could use.

[Ghostrider]

Boris Johnson is playing a very dangerous game - attempting to "take back control" from the EU by attempting to bypass the sovereign parliament Brexiters wish to have more power.

 

Today's events bode very badly for British democratic processes, and it is ironic that many Brexit supporters seem to be happy about it. Reverting to the tired old 'will of the people' referendum rhetoric is ridiculous when a 'no-deal' agenda that was never proposed during the referendum.

 

Unless, of course, Brexiters are happy with a sovereign parliament that can be switched on and off on the whim of a Prime Minister.

 

We appear to be heading toward dictatorial facism.

 

He may well be playing a dangerous game, but desperate times call for desperate measures, and in the end, what he's done is no different from what remainers have been doing for three years.

 

This endless pointless limbo needs to be concluded, one way or another, as its far more damaging in the long run than any other alternative.

 

Democracy has had a damn good ass kickin from remainers for three years, there was no particular version of how we were to 'Leave' on the referendum ballot, it simply said 'Leave'. By default that means ALL versions of leaving were supported by the leave vote. We (stupidly, apparently) trusted parliament to put together a tolerable 'leave' package with the EU, but after three years we're no nearer to that than we were on day one, mainly, IMHO, due to remainers doing everythng they possibly could to ignore the outcome of the referendum and thwart us leaving in any way at all.

 

Had remainers respected the referendum outcome and either tried to work with everyone else for the best deal within a 'leave' framework, or if they couldn't bring themselves to do that, at the very least siply step back and not sabotage the work others were doing to try and get a decent leave deal, we might well have been in a much better position today.

 

Remainers have played a dangerous game for three years by ignoring the result of a democratic referendum and backing one polarised extreme, all Boris has done with this is outplay them by putting the opposite polarised extreme on the table. So its a bit bloody rich that remainers are now bleating about democracy when they themselves have paid it scant regard in the pursuit of their own extremist viewpoint for three years, and have contributed significantly to creating the current situation by pursuing it as far as they have done.

[Davie P]

Lets remember that we have 650 MPs in parliament all on a salary of something like £76000 per year this totals to £49,400,000 lets ask ourselves is this value for money to let this group argue among themselves,getting nowhere , at the tax payers expense,and that not counting expenses.

 

Can you imagine any other organization operating in this way.

 

Would any of us hire a group of "work persons " to do a job all on say £25 an hour and allow them to stand around and argue amongst themselves all day at your own expense because that how I see our politicians.

 

Boris spoke about this country needing higher pay and productivity,well I do not see much productivity coming out of our houses of parliament.

 

Ma'be Boris has cracked the whip 

 

Are you seriously trying to justify the Prime Minister bypassing parliament on an important constitutional issue because you think MPs get paid too much??

[Davie P]

Remainers have played a dangerous game for three years by ignoring the result of a democratic referendum and backing one polarised extreme, all Boris has done with this is outplay them by putting the opposite polarised extreme on the table. So its a bit bloody rich that remainers are now bleating about democracy when they themselves have paid it scant regard in the pursuit of their own extremist viewpoint for three years, and have contributed significantly to creating the current situation by pursuing it as far as they have done.

 

 

All Leave has is pre-legislative referendum over 3 years ago - off that back of they they have consistently tried to circumvent laws and democratic parliamentary processes to push their agenda through, an agenda that is now a distant relation from what was promised. To accuse people who wish to see laws and democratic processes observed as having an 'extremist viewpoint' is just nonsense.

[Urabug]

 

Lets remember that we have 650 MPs in parliament all on a salary of something like £76000 per year this totals to £49,400,000 lets ask ourselves is this value for money to let this group argue among themselves,getting nowhere , at the tax payers expense,and that not counting expenses.

 

Can you imagine any other organization operating in this way.

 

Would any of us hire a group of "work persons " to do a job all on say £25 an hour and allow them to stand around and argue amongst themselves all day at your own expense because that how I see our politicians.

 

Boris spoke about this country needing higher pay and productivity,well I do not see much productivity coming out of our houses of parliament.

 

Ma'be Boris has cracked the whip 

 

Are you seriously trying to justify the Prime Minister bypassing parliament on an important constitutional issue because you think MPs get paid too much??

 

Never said they get paid to much ,but I do question whether we get value for money. Productivity do you see any ,in any of our parliaments 

 

Something had to be done to get out of this perpetual loop and Boris has done it, be it right or wrong ,but we were going no where anyway ,now we on on another phase probably back to the ballet box.

[Ghostrider]

 

Remainers have played a dangerous game for three years by ignoring the result of a democratic referendum and backing one polarised extreme, all Boris has done with this is outplay them by putting the opposite polarised extreme on the table. So its a bit bloody rich that remainers are now bleating about democracy when they themselves have paid it scant regard in the pursuit of their own extremist viewpoint for three years, and have contributed significantly to creating the current situation by pursuing it as far as they have done.

 

 

All Leave has is pre-legislative referendum over 3 years ago - off that back of they they have consistently tried to circumvent laws and democratic parliamentary processes to push their agenda through, an agenda that is now a distant relation from what was promised. To accuse people who wish to see laws and democratic processes observed as having an 'extremist viewpoint' is just nonsense.

 

 

Its exactly what was promised, its 'leave' in its most base form. Stop paying, close the door and walk away.

 

Parliament and the EU have spent three years bickering over other versions/interpretations of 'leave', and have failed to make any progress whatsoever. The most base interpretation of 'leave' is all that is left to run with and still respect the result of the democratic referendum. The stalemate needs broken or we'll just limp along in slowly dragging the country in to a bottomless pit as we've been doing for the last three years.

 

While some may wish to "see laws and the democratic process observed", they have a very strange way of showing it. The referendum was part of the democratic process, but apparently its okay to ignore that in the pursuit of some other aspect of democracy. Additionally, and IMHO, is the greater problem, of remainers who will go to any and all lengths to remain. These are the extremists, and it is they for the majority who have shouted loudest and done the greatest damage in preventing a decent deal to be struck. They want to remain at any and all costs, quite literally anything is expendable to achieve their goal.

 

The fundamental problem outwith extremism is that Parliament and some of the population view the situation as its up to parliament to decide what is best for the nation, bearing in mind the outcome of the referendum, and a probably roughly equal at least part of the population view the situation as the nation has instructed parliament what it wants done, and they expect parliament to deliver exactly that. May tried to do it the former way, and got nowhere with nobody and nothing, Boris is, so far at least, or so it would appear, trying to do it the latter way.

 

These are the only two ways forward, one has had more than a fair chance to deliver, and after three years has failed absolutely miserably, the other is all we have left to go with, as the alternative of doing nothing isn't an option as its just a slide in to oblivion.

 

A 'no deal' exit now is the result of a three year failure by parliament to do their job. had we left with a 'no deal' as quickly as possibleafter the referendum we'd be in a much better place now, the inevitable bump in the road would be ling behind us and we'd be well in to the process of rebuilding, Had parliament struck a deal along the way, the bump in the road should have been smaller, and with any luck behind us now also.

 

Instead, as a result of endless bickering, stalling and outright sabotage, we're still stuck in limbo waiting for the bup in the road to arrive someplace around the corner, while the nation slowly commits suicide due to investors both domestic and foreign sitting on their hands waiting for the uncertainty to end.

[mikeyboy]

So the SNP leader is calling Boris a dictator due to his decision to suspend parliament, surely this must be a case of the "pot calling the kettle black".

 

How please explain?

 

With so much open rhetoric going on between our politicians,our EU leaders just have to sit back and do nothing ,they have presented us with a deal ,apparently no longer negotiable, which has been rejected but still the "remoaners" fight tooth and nail .

 

What do you expect the EU to do? The EU negotiated a deal with May who then could not get it through parliament against her section of her own party.

 

This must be "open dealing " the EU just have to sit back and watch the pantomime and do nothing and they have got it all there own way ,unless of course Boris manages to get us out.

 

Let democracy run it's course ,leave the EU as the majority of GREAT BRITAIN voted, and get the country back on track .

 

Completely untrue, the majority of the UK did not vote to leave the UK.

 

Tomorrow I will vote but only for someone who respects democracy,not tactfully but not sure I care who gets in now,they all full of promises that we know  will never be fulfilled  

[Urabug]

 

So the SNP leader is calling Boris a dictator due to his decision to suspend parliament, surely this must be a case of the "pot calling the kettle black".

 

How please explain?

 

With so much open rhetoric going on between our politicians,our EU leaders just have to sit back and do nothing ,they have presented us with a deal ,apparently no longer negotiable, which has been rejected but still the "remoaners" fight tooth and nail .

 

What do you expect the EU to do? The EU negotiated a deal with May who then could not get it through parliament against her section of her own party.

 

This must be "open dealing " the EU just have to sit back and watch the pantomime and do nothing and they have got it all there own way ,unless of course Boris manages to get us out.

 

Let democracy run it's course ,leave the EU as the majority of GREAT BRITAIN voted, and get the country back on track .

 

Completely untrue, the majority of the UK did not vote to leave the UK.

 

Tomorrow I will vote but only for someone who respects democracy,not tactfully but not sure I care who gets in now,they all full of promises that we know  will never be fulfilled  

 

Copied of line:--   On 23 June 2016, the recorded result was that the UK voted to leave the European Union by 51.89% for Leave to 48.11% for Remain, a margin of 3.78%. This corresponded to 17,410,742 votes to leave and 16,141,241 to remain, a margin of 1,269,501 votes.

[mikeyboy]

Yes that means that 51.89% of those that were able to or interested enough to vote voted leave.

Which is not the same as the majority of Great Britain.

But thanks for posting a reference.