Infiltrator

Last few years of St Clements were pretty poor to be honest, full of young bairns and social casualties. It was always good for 'making up time'. Posers is just too small and it's layout doesn't lend itself that well to an Up Helly Aa hall. Probably the best hall in Lerwick that isn't being used is the Masonic. Used to be open. Well sited, good access and facilities for UHA. There must be some reluctance on the part of the Masonic, I know it's been raised and discussed many times but it never gets any further. Personally think that hotels should be avoided, any hall that you wouldn't be happy letting a herd of cows graze in and hose down afterwards is way too posh and they're missing the point...

Suggest you email zettrans@shetland.gov.uk and let them know of your experience. They previously asked for Flybe experiences prior to a meeting with Flybe.

Security? I remember they used to announce over the tannoy 'anyone not sailing with the ship go back onshore' Regards the hull colour of the Clair (3) - I seem to think she was light blue when she arrived, only to be promptly painted 'fleet' black. I thought I had a photo somewhere but can't seem to find it. The light blue was such a different colour to the drab black that we were used to seeing.

I was also on one of the old boats on a trip to Orkney as a youngster, couldn't rememeber the name but can remember she only carried 12 passengers (how I rememeber that I don't know). Search on the above site shows it was the St Rognvald (3).

I certainly had a few trips on the old Clair when she berthed at the steamer store - although I was quite young. When we went on a school trip we went on either the very last sailing of the old Clair or the first sailing of the new Clair - can't remember. http://www.simplonpc.co.uk/PeterPan1965.html I do remember the breakfasts (tea/toast) delivered to each cabin in the mornings. Never on the Earl but remember her well. Also remember going to Bressay on the Brenda

So, is there or isn't there? I can't see it, unless the procession has been rerouted along the street and the burning is outside the Bank of Scotland http://www.shetland-news.co.uk/letters_12_2008/Andy%20promises%20virtual%20New%20Year.htm Mind you - there seems to be some real workers in the tourist office - maybe there'll be summit after all?

Should we tell him?

I'd be intrigued to know the %split between tourists and locals (or folk with a local connection, e.g. me. I no longer live on the isles but wouldn't class my trips to Shetland as a tourist even though I pay tourist rates) When I've travelled before, even in the midst of the summer, a large % of the folk you see onboard are locals.

What I suggested was to find alternative work for the 2nd ferry through the winter months - maybe it's not that simple but certainly other firms do this (Smyril used to) I really need a car as my family are at both ends of the isles. I also think there's a conspiracy between NL and the car hire companies in Shetland - there's not much difference in cost between taking your car on the ferry or hiring a car for a long weekend. I thought this was good idea, didn't work for me last year but will see what happens this year. Long term I can't see the government continuing to subsidise to the current level. Somethings got to give and a single passenger ferry on the route must be pretty high on the list of options.

I didn't suggest this all year round - I said the winter months My whole point was to reduce the service which will reduce the overall operating cost - if this can be done then the ticket costs could be reduced with the subsidy maintained at the same level I don't qualify for concessions - £600 for a weekend return trip with a car might seem to be good value for some folks but for me it stops me travelling back to the isles as often as I'd like.

I'm not sure I agree with this as a reason for a passenger ferry sailing each night. Is it not the case that fish leaves Shetland daily because it can? I go back to my main issue on this - reduce the ticket prices on the Northlink for passengers and it'll attract more tourists to the isles. If the service continues as it is it's likely to lead to an increase in costs as I can't see the government continuing to subsidise it to the level it's doing now. I have good reason to use the service, to visit family, but the cost makes it something I do on a less regular basis than I'd like when I can get better value for my money going elsewhere. If I think this then what do the tourists think when they're looking for where to spend their hard earned cash.

So why can't we manage with a single ferry? Even just through the winter if it can't work through summer - send the other ferry to pootle around the Med for a few months. There's certainly been a big disruption to the schedule so far this winter and we're about to enter the 'dry dock' season. Surely this would reduce costs and ticket prices?

This happened to both the Clair and the Sunniva (or was it the last two Clairs?) - I seem to remember it was on both their maiden voyages as well. Completely different designs to the new boats so the circumstances must have been different. Just goes to show the sheer energy behind freak waves. There was an interesting documentary a few years ago on freak waves - a number of ships have been lost or badly damaged by these waves. Given the route and time spent on passages, it must be statistically possible that the boats will encounter these conditions at some point.

While we're harking on about the high cost of ferry fares - is there a real need for 2 ferries? Would there be any support for a much cheaper fare structure if the service could be reduced somehow. Certainly through the heart of winter, passenger levels are so low that the service must run at a huge loss. Have the recent cancellations for stormy weather had any significant impact on the local economy? Plus, during catch up trips, they have managed quicker turnarounds and shorter passages. I've always maintained that the largest untapped resouce on the islands is tourism - but the sheer cost of getting tourists to and from the isles will always keep folk away. My last trip home with a car and cabin cost me close to £600 - ferry fares like this will do nothing to attract tourists - in fact it's even putting me off - I could have a long weekend in Amsterdam, Paris or even Barcelona for this price, hmmm....

Mareel is being funded 100% from public money, I'd have been much happier with supporting the project if some of the funding was being sought from the private sector and the main supporters were carrying some of the risk. If it's as profitable as has been forecast then I'm surprised the private sector weren't beating a path to the North Ness to throw funding at the project.

You can't compare the P&O of old with Northlink - the world has moved on. Even a P&O service today wouldn't have the same service as they used to provide, they'd be under the same business, financial and HSE pressures as Northlink are. Even the P&O service changed over it's life - who remembers the delivered to cabin tea and toast wake up call on the old Clair?

My old man was a passenger that night and there was quite a lot of 'concerned' passengers that night. Pretty sure she turned back on at least one other occassion. Personally I prefer the Northlink policy of 'not sailing for passenger comfort' than the old 'we'll give it a go' policy. Should they have sailed at all that night?

About 1978 or 1979, first Ro-ro Clair, before they fitted proper stabilisers. They set off one night in pretty poor conditions on one engine, got somewhere out past the Ness of Sound and found they couldn't make any progress into the weather. The turning manoeuvre given the conditions and condition of the vessel was risky but the only option.

Do you honestly think the SIC are the only UK council to hold Tesco shares in their pension portfolio? Most UK pension funds, council or private, will have Tesco, BP, Shell and RBS shares plus one or two of the other top FTSE companies. Like them or not, Tesco shares are seen as a reliable investment with good returns. I'd suggest it'd be easier to find a council that doesn't have Tesco shares in their pension fund. Wills should really know better

Its not that easy for people to leave. Specially when they keep cancelling the ferry

Name me another ferry service in the country/world that'll provide free accomodation as it's cancelled it's departure due to bad weather? Living on an island has it's plus points and it's bad points - this just happens to be one of the downsides - if you don't like it you have options. The captain of the ferry is qualified and experienced to make decisions about when to sail and when not to sail - you have to respect that decision. And don't keep harking back to the old P&O days, they were very lucky once or twice not to have a disaster on their hands sailing when they should have known better.

Not a weekend for the ferry I think, below from Metoffice. Fri 19 Dec 1200 Sunny intervals 6°C SW 22 mph Excellent 1500 Sleet 6°C S 32 mph 49 mph Good 1800 Heavy Rain 5°C S 45 mph 69 mph Poor 2100 Heavy Rain 8°C SSW 40 mph 74 mph Poor Sat 20 Dec 0000 Light Rain Shower 8°C W 37 mph 85 mph Excellent 0300 Light Rain Shower 6°C WNW 46 mph 82 mph Excellent 0600 Light Rain Shower 6°C WNW 39 mph 68 mph Excellent 0900 Light Rain Shower 6°C WNW 30 mph 60 mph Excellent 1200 Light Rain Shower 7°C WNW 39 mph 49 mph Very Good 1500 Clear Sky 7°C WNW 31 mph 42 mph Very Good 1800 Partly cloudy 7°C WNW 21 mph 33 mph Very Good Night Heavy Rain 5°C SSW 16 mph Poor Sun 21 Dec Day Heavy Rain Shower 10°C SW 37 mph 53 mph Poor Night Heavy Rain Shower 6°C WNW 45 mph 73 mph Poor

Fair point - maybe the Milk issue should have it's own thread if it has the potential to have such a huge local economic impact.

Maybe we should start a new poll - Do you want a bigger Tesco in Shetland? I'm in favour - but I don't live there anymore so my opinion probably doesn't count I think a lot of folks already bypass the local retailers and order stuff direct, this is more likely to have had an impact on local retailers than anything else.

Tesco planning application being discussed by the council tomorrow - including an SIC study which suggests the extension could reduce local retail jobs by approx 300 - and there's 20 posts on here discussing milk Unusual no-one seems to have an opinion, personally I think someone should have a quiet word with the planning dept and the local retailers assoc and let them know that apparently you can buy stuff from the internet nowadays