Smoking e cigarettes in shops..

[Sukibind]

Last friday in the Scrapstore I saw 2 members of staff smoking e cigarettes at the counter, I was quite shocked as I thought smoking was forbidden in shops, or are e cigarettes allowed? Either way, it looked awful.

[shetlandpeat]

There is a growing trend to ban this by employers and bus companies.

 

The County Council here have a policy that outlaws any form of smoking in company vehicles or any form of smoking in work time.

The reason for this is to remove confusion, simply because those who have been caught in the past claimed to have been smoking e-cigs when it was late proved they do not use them.

 

Personally, I find it unsightly and unprofessional and still carries risks to those who do not smoke. After all, why should I breath in someone elses nicotine.

 

Bus services have also banned the use of ecigs on their buses, and rightly so.

 

There has been much believed by the public that these are harmless, I would agree that on the onset, they are far better than smoking tobacco if used as a means to eradicate your nicotine addiction I do worry as ait is now used as a cheap replacement. I do know a few folk whose voices are changing as well as a mearked increase in nicotine consumption.

Edited February 5, 2014 by shetlandpeat

[brian.smith]

There is a growing trend to ban this by employers and bus companies.

 

The County Council here have a policy that outlaws any form of smoking in company vehicles or any form of smoking in work time.

The reason for this is to remove confusion, simply because those who have been caught in the past claimed to have been smoking e-cigs when it was late proved they do not use them.

 

Personally, I find it unsightly and unprofessional and still carries risks to those who do not smoke. After all, why should I breath in someone elses nicotine.

 

Bus services have also banned the use of ecigs on their buses, and rightly so.

 

There has been much believed by the public that these are harmless, I would agree that on the onset, they are far better than smoking tobacco if used as a means to eradicate your nicotine addiction I do worry as ait is now used as a cheap replacement. I do know a few folk whose voices are changing as well as a mearked increase in nicotine consumption.

And your proof on harm comes from where and no I dont smoke them

[shetlandpeat]

There was a recent report that stated that they are 10 times less harmful than smoking cigarettes.

 

However, due to the difficulty in testing these without the use of animals (remember, the e-cig was marketed as a means to stop smoking) the risks are unknown, as the following link mentions, there have been no harmful effects of lab rats, but, these liquids contain other unknown substances and the effects of the purfumes and flavours added to them. Then, of course, there are the conditions of the production areas they are also made in, the risks of uncontrolled measures of flavour or purfumes. Add any contaminate that could enter the process.

There has been a little research in Greece where it was found that in the majority of those tested using an e-cigarette caused an instant increase in airway resistance that lasted for 10 minutes.

 

There is also a worry that these devices are normalising smoking behaviour, something it has been agreed should be prevented and these devices marketed as a tool to give up smoking.

 

On another personal note, again, at times, you can smell the "smoke" on people and in the places they use them, especially if they are using tobacco tasting purfumes and flavourings. The risks I have seen includes bus drivers using them, and one who was trying to top up his device when driving.

 

Still, I do think they can help folk stop smoking and hopefully prevent some from suffering agonising deaths.

 

The good news about tobacco smoking is that it has reached a low of <20% of the population. This may be helped by the >750,000 folk now believed to be using e-cigs.

Edited February 5, 2014 by shetlandpeat

[Sukibind]

At first look I thought it was a real cigarette, it wasn't till I got close that I realised it wasn't. I don't think it should be allowed, it encourages the smoking habit and young people wont necessarily know the difference.

[brian.smith]

There was a recent report that stated that they are 10 times less harmful than smoking cigarettes.

 

However, due to the difficulty in testing these without the use of animals (remember, the e-cig was marketed as a means to stop smoking) the risks are unknown, as the following link mentions, there have been no harmful effects of lab rats, but, these liquids contain other unknown substances and the effects of the purfumes and flavours added to them. Then, of course, there are the conditions of the production areas they are also made in, the risks of uncontrolled measures of flavour or purfumes. Add any contaminate that could enter the process.

There has been a little research in Greece where it was found that in the majority of those tested using an e-cigarette caused an instant increase in airway resistance that lasted for 10 minutes.

 

There is also a worry that these devices are normalising smoking behaviour, something it has been agreed should be prevented and these devices marketed as a tool to give up smoking.

 

On another personal note, again, at times, you can smell the "smoke" on people and in the places they use them, especially if they are using tobacco tasting purfumes and flavourings. The risks I have seen includes bus drivers using them, and one who was trying to top up his device when driving.

 

Still, I do think they can help folk stop smoking and hopefully prevent some from suffering agonising deaths.

 

The good news about tobacco smoking is that it has reached a low of <20% of the population. This may be helped by the >750,000 folk now believed to be using e-cigs.

Im lost how can you smell smoke when these things expell water vapour

[Colin]

There was a recent report that stated that they are 10 times less harmful than smoking cigarettes.

 

However, due to the difficulty in testing these without the use of animals (remember, the e-cig was marketed as a means to stop smoking) the risks are unknown, as the following link mentions, there have been no harmful effects of lab rats, but, these liquids contain other unknown substances and the effects of the purfumes and flavours added to them. Then, of course, there are the conditions of the production areas they are also made in, the risks of uncontrolled measures of flavour or purfumes. Add any contaminate that could enter the process.

There has been a little research in Greece where it was found that in the majority of those tested using an e-cigarette caused an instant increase in airway resistance that lasted for 10 minutes.

 

There is also a worry that these devices are normalising smoking behaviour, something it has been agreed should be prevented and these devices marketed as a tool to give up smoking.

 

On another personal note, again, at times, you can smell the "smoke" on people and in the places they use them, especially if they are using tobacco tasting purfumes and flavourings. The risks I have seen includes bus drivers using them, and one who was trying to top up his device when driving.

 

Still, I do think they can help folk stop smoking and hopefully prevent some from suffering agonising deaths.

 

The good news about tobacco smoking is that it has reached a low of <20% of the population. This may be helped by the >750,000 folk now believed to be using e-cigs.

 

Seen a few different reports myself and, each one claims different levels of benefit(?) for e-cigs.

 

When I bought a couple of them the packaging DID NOT claim that they were a method(?) of stopping smoking but, instead, claimed that they were a substitue that contained only nicotine.

 

As for the conditions of the 'production areas'.  I would imagine that any cartridges purchased from a reputable supplier/manufacturer would be made in a 'proper' environment.

 

Normalising smoking behaviour(?).  I would think that (from figures I have seen) 20%+ of the population smoking is 'normal behaviour'.  If not, why are the government taxing it so heavily.

 

Are they a 'good thing'?  I think that the answer to that is a qualified 'Yes'

Should they be banned from certain areas of our lives.  I think that, within reason, the answer should be 'No'

Do they encourage non smokers to smoke.  Again I think that the answer to that would also be No.

 

Don't fall for all the hype that you are fed by various pressure groups.

[Colin]

 

Im lost how can you smell smoke when these things expell water vapour

 

 

From personal experience, you can't smell smoke.

 

It's just that some people get a bit hysterical when they see a ciggie.

[shetlandpeat]

Of course you can smell them, those that use tobacco flavourings smell of tobacco or smoke, they are designed to taste like a cigarette, some are flavoured to taste like butterscotch or red bull even, the flavourings are in the vapour and linger. Otherwise, why would they then flavour them? The "just water vapour" is not so, as it must contain nicotine and the flavourings.

[Colin]

Last friday in the Scrapstore I saw 2 members of staff smoking e cigarettes at the counter, I was quite shocked as I thought smoking was forbidden in shops, or are e cigarettes allowed? Either way, it looked awful.

Shame that you were "quite shocked" but, smoking is not illegal (yet), e-cigs are NOT illegal and, as far as I am aware, NOT included in the draconian smoking ban.

Whether someone is allowed to use them (e-cigs) at their place of work must, surely, be down to the wishes of the employer.

Personally, I would prefer to pay members of staff to sit at their desks and not stand outside. 

[Colin]

Of course you can smell them, those that use tobacco flavourings smell of tobacco or smoke, they are designed to taste like a cigarette, some are flavoured to taste like butterscotch or red bull even, the flavourings are in the vapour and linger. Otherwise, why would they then flavour them? The "just water vapour" is not so, as it must contain nicotine and the flavourings.

Well, there must be something wrong with my nose then..

I have a couple of e-cigs and, I can taste them but, cannot smell them.

I would agree that some of the nicotine would be exhaled but, to the best of my knowledge, nicotine is odorless.

PS, I do not use any of the fancy flavourings that are available.

[shetlandpeat]

 

Personally, I would prefer to pay members of staff to sit at their desks and not stand outside. 

 

I would pay more if they gave up all together.

 

Many companies that actively helped employees to quit smoking reaped the benefits of a healthier staff, less time of sick and less breaks.

 

One guy at our place used to take 10 minutes 8 or nine times a day.

 

The BMA has said this, there is also a mention on what is in the vapour, but still agrees that it is the lesser of the two evils. There is also research on passive "vaping".

 

Regulation will happen, though some may say it is so they can be taxed, they will be wrong. Due to the chemicals in the vapour and their incorrect labeling, as well as the issue with youngsters thinking that they can be "cool" smoking these, it is needed. It will help to establish any other risks.

As for the Tax, the less smokers there are, the less they will cost the NHS. I have yet to find evidence that says they contribute more in taxes than they take. especially if you include the cost of health care, cost of time off from work, cost of SSP and the costs the Fire Brigade have to incure as well as the car accidents that the distraction of smoking can cause. Of course though, having a CD player in a car makes it OK.

[Ghostrider]

I have yet to find evidence that says they contribute more in taxes than they take. especially if you include the cost of health care, cost of time off from work, cost of SSP and the costs the Fire Brigade have to incure as well as the car accidents that the distraction of smoking can cause.

 

Conversely, have you found any evidence that smokers cost the country more than they contribute in tax? Have you ever looked for any evidence? I doubt it.

 

A pair of shapely female legs below a bum hugging mini skirt causes much more distraction than lighting a fag does, you want to ban them too?

[JustMe]

I am an ex-smoker having given up some time ago.  Cannot be certain but I am sure it is close to 10 years.  Now this thread made me have a look at these "smoking devices" on the internet and confess that I was briefly tempted to send off for a free sample until I realised that, for me, they could be a short cut back to addiction not only to nicotine but to the very action of smoking.  Great if they encourage people to quit but not so good if they become addicted to these devices.

[shetlandpeat]

^ An expected response.

 

Firstly, it is difficult to obtain a true cost as many of the costs of smoking tobacco are amongst other costs as I have indicated/

 

As for a distraction, you choose to smoke, you also choose not to stop.

 

Still, on topic, reducing the premature deaths of folk has to be a priority, especially those who do not choose to smoke tobacco products.

 

 

Smoking remains the main cause of preventable morbidity and

premature death in England, leading to an estimated annual

average of 81,900 deaths in 2005.

 

 A wide range of diseases and conditions are caused by cigarette

smoking including cancers, respiratory disease, coronary heart and

other circulatory diseases, stomach and duodenal ulcers and

erectile dysfunction.

 

 It is estimated that 20% of people with cardiovascular disease

(CVD) are smokers. The British

Heart Foundation estimates that

mortality from coronary heart dis

ease (CHD) is around 60% higher

in people who smoke (80% in

heavy smokers) than in non-

smokers.

 

Smoking costs the NHS in

England about £1.5 billion per year

(Raw et al. 1999).

1.3.5 In England in 2006 about 24%

of people aged 16 and

over smoked.

Jarvis and Wardle (1999) found that the prevalence of smoking has

declined dramatically si

nce the 1970s, but it still remains alarmingly

high in some groups. These include people aged 20–34, women

who continue to smoke through

pregnancy, members of some

minority ethnic communities and t

hose from lower socioeconomic

groups.

 

Smoking in pregnancy increases

infant mortality by about 40% and

more than a quarter of unexpected deaths in infancy are

attributable to smoking

(British Medical Association 2004