Blueprint for education consultation

[paulb]

its one option. to transfer the kids at p7.

[peeriebryan]

^ some proposed transfers would be at S1, not P7. There's a report here - http://www.shetlandtimes.co.uk/2009/11/19/major-programme-of-school-closures-back-on-the-agenda-for-shetland

[jz]

There are no plans to shut the Mid Yell school, quite the opposite. More pupils will be moved there under the proposals

 

From the council web site, specifically http://www.shetland.gov.uk/coins/submissiondocuments.asp?submissionid=9944

 

"North Isles - Yell

 

 

Secondary Education

 

Viable Options

 

Discontinue a stage of education at S4 in Yell (with transfer to Lerwick at end of S3)

 

Discontinue stages of education from S1 to S4 in Yell (with transfer to Lerwick or Brae at end of P7)

"

 

So one option would be to close down the secondary department (currently under construction).

 

 

I would suggest that this shouldn't really be a "viable option".

[MJ]

So finally I get an answer about what is planned for my daughters exam years. Have they figured out if the new Anderson is big enough? (not likely that it'll even be built in time) It's not as though they weren't given enough notice of the changes. Is there any hope though that they'll provide enough bus seats for all the extra children having to commute 1hr or more each way. Or will they continue to expect parents to get so exasperated that they have to run them to school instead. And how to get round the whole no where to put the Sandness kids and long over due extension of happyhansel. Just close both, oh and put another nail in the coffin for skeld.

I would make encouraging noises about finally saving money on a vastly over budget, very basic education service, but I can see these changes, costing vast sums of money, and folk still assuming if you spend more on education per head of capita that it actually means they're receiving the "best" education.

[trowie246]

 

 

It is most likely Mid Yell will keep its Secondary dept. but you have to be mindful that this is only providing education up until end of S.3.

 

That means that a child from Unst or Fetlar will attend Mid Yell until that time. If they decide to leave the school at 16years they will either have to commute to Brae each day (2 ferries) for their final year or move to Lerwick. This is adding one extra transition period onto their education - the very opposite of what the education dept. is trying to do.

 

Presently there are absolutely no plans to build a new hostel in Lerwick. Pupils will be expected to walk across town each day to the new school.

 

These proposals are worrying for alot of parents in the isles but worse for parents whose children have additional special needs. Don't know how my friends son who has Aspergers and diabetes will cope for a year either in Brae or Lerwick.

[paulb]

very true.

 

there policy will make keeping the northern isles viable harder.

 

so we know why they planned anderson so vastly over size. will the kids from whalsay be boarding as well. that with the kids from yell and unst is going to put a strain on the hostel.

 

with sandwick and aith and not forgetting scalloway losing half there classes is that not going to make the per pupil cost go up.

 

with a new build for the westside and other schools that merge is this a wise idea. would it not have been more sensible to treat all the high and junior highs as one vast school this would then save all the moving about. with a bit of co-operation the new education system would be workable.

 

though i would hate to see skeld school go i could understand it if it was for a better education but i don't see that happening. its plain old money. the school on the skerries must be the first to go. how about selling the school on papa stour now that really would make sense a school with 0 on the role.

[stephen]

I have mixed thoughts about the blueprint. It is clear that the Local Authority has far to many schools for the population - that being said, the demographics of the Shetland Islands does call for 'spread out' schools. What I think is quite silly (financially), in further up north the number of small schools in a repetitively small geographic area. I personally also dislike single or dual class schools as I feel that having a huge age range of children in 1 class can be detrimental to their education and their social development (they do need peers of a similar age to socialise with).

 

You also need to consider the staffing costs for small schools. a teacher, a head, admin staff, auxiliaries and catering. Add in the cost of building maintenance and the cost of small schools really hits home. As council budgets have been slashed this does seem like a practical and sensible approach to save money.

 

I also understand that schools are key to some communities, and also a key aspect of the social life of people who live in remote areas - this certainly would be effected by the closure.

 

Playing devils advocate, I thing the high school plan is sensible. When you look at resources, facilities and staffing and compare the population here to that in similar sized towns down south. I would have thought it much more sensible to heave a 6 year secondary in Lerwick and then on Yell - lets face it, Brae isn't that far from Lerwick and is on a good road!

 

I suppose at the end of the day it is all down to personal opinion, and I wouldn't want to make the decision - there is no right answer... they will all be wrong (but that is politics). I really don't envy the council staff!!!

[paulb]

yes i could just see them merging brae and the anderson. think of the bus costs.

 

treat up here like a town down south does not work. yes you could make big schools in the north and south and even the westsiders could go to aith but is that worth the loss of community and social connection.

 

travelling down to lerwick each day will make a kids day a lot longer.

[stephen]

treat up here like a town down south does not work. yes you could make big schools in the north and south and even the westsiders could go to aith but is that worth the loss of community and social connection.

 

travelling down to lerwick each day will make a kids day a lot longer.

 

No, I do agree, I was meaning to flag up the council costs (as in schooling here is vastly more expensive) and will have to be paid for now the oil subsidy is deteriorating etc.

 

I think having secondary schools up to S3 is pointless and potentially damaging to the children. Can you imagine being shipped off to another school for 1 year, where almost everybody has known each other for quite some time and being expected to sit exams? Shetland needs 2 six year secondary that are accessible to the majority.

 

I don't like the idea of the Hostel as an answer. Yes, it is needed for the outlying islands but not for those that are on the mainland.

 

I don't think the travelling argument is relevant. I travelled 40 minutes by bus to my secondary and back. The LA could adjust the timetable to suit (ie a 9:15 start).

[trowie246]

It is a myth generated by the Education dept. that primary education here in Shetland is expensive. We have more schools, more teaching staff and more pupils than Orkney yet per head of pupil we are actually cheaper than them. We are higher than the national average but delivery of education to the islands is always going to be more expensive than mainland Scotland.

 

Secondary education in Shetland is expensive. VERY expensive.

 

If You close Cullivoe primary school you will save £50,000 per year. But if as has been promised primary children would get there own transport this figure will be much less. Education in Shetland costs £34 million pounds per year. Some people may think £50,000 is still £50,000 but to my mind it is a drop in the ocean and so not worth it.

[tarhellja]

Tomorrow's paper is going to be good. Allegedly, the Times had info leaked to them from an unknown source regarding the subject.

[stephen]

If You close Cullivoe primary school you will save £50,000 per year. But if as has been promised primary children would get there own transport this figure will be much less. Education in Shetland costs £34 million pounds per year. Some people may think £50,000 is still £50,000 but to my mind it is a drop in the ocean and so not worth it.

 

That it perhaps the properties cost, but not the whole picture. Remember the school needs resources and licences too... and staff.

 

Head teacher - £40,290

Class teacher - £25, 113

ASN Auxiliary - £15,000

ASN Auxiliary - £15,000

Classroom As. - £13,000

Admin - £15,000

Supervisor - £5,000

 

Total staffing costs per year - £113, 403

 

These figures are bottom of the pay scale figures, and are likely to be much higher. They do not take into account visiting specialists or posts that are being advertised. They also don't take into account employer contributions. I would guestimate that the true staffing costs of Cullivoe is about £200,000 per year.

 

So, you can see that your £50,000 is really more like £1/4 million (over £20k per pupil, per year).

[Styles]

£30,000,000 is spent a year on education in Shetland, its a crazy ammount. Schools have to close. Just hope the Council this time have the guts to do so.

[trowie246]

That it perhaps the properties cost, but not the whole picture. Remember the school needs resources and licences too... and staff.

 

Head teacher - £40,290

Class teacher - £25, 113

ASN Auxiliary - £15,000

ASN Auxiliary - £15,000

Classroom As. - £13,000

Admin - £15,000

Supervisor - £5,000

 

Total staffing costs per year - £113, 403

 

These figures are bottom of the pay scale figures, and are likely to be much higher. They do not take into account visiting specialists or posts that are being advertised. They also don't take into account employer contributions. I would guestimate that the true staffing costs of Cullivoe is about £200,000 per year.

 

So, you can see that your £50,000 is really more like £1/4 million (over £20k per pupil, per year).

 

ASN staff will travel with the child to Mid Yell. They will not lose their jobs. This is also the same for visiting teachers - they visit different schools so they will not lose their jobs. The sum of £50,000 was the figure quoted to us when they tried to close Cullivoe school 3 years ago.

[trowie246]

Also, people seem to forget these children do not simply vanish when they go to another school. That school also needs extra resources and extra teaching staff. If they close Cullivoe and Burravoe the new Mid Yelll school will have to be extended, because it is not big enough. It is also possible that they will have to employ another classroom teacher.