Shetland windfarm - Viking Energy

[Ghostrider]

 

 

The third point is still unproven as far as I'm concerned, the longer term effects on living creatures, if any, of sound at frequencies outwith human auditory range is far from wholly understood, as are those of the production and transportation of high voltage electricity. If you are satisfied the risks are minimal enough that you can sleep nights, good on you, but many folk don't have that privilege.

 

 

Yes - unproven. Which would mean no-one has proven a definitive link between windfarms and effects on long term health and we can't definitively say one way or another. But given that we're constantly exposed to sounds beyond the range of human hearing - along with spectrums of light that we cannot see, natural and man made radio waves, etc, etc - and no-one's complaining about those, I'm willing to bet "infrasound" is utter bøllocks. If it and "the flicker effect" were real, than anyone living within sight and sound of a motorway would be in serious danger from constantly passing traffic. I've yet to see anyone in a motorway services convulsing after a string of juggernauts thunders past.

 

It's kind of weird how the people who are pro-windfarm or whatever else never suffer the ill-health effects that some of the anti brigade would like us to believe exist.

 

 

Its your money to risk, but I won't be risking mine on that bet, and I don't see motorway traffic as being a like with like comparison with light being shadowed or reflected off windmill blades.

 

Nothing weird at all about anti's being the most vocal about possible negative health effects. As while anti's may in some cases make the most of it, pro's also have their own agenda to serve by denying and ignoring such things.

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

Uninhabitable? I doubt that a wind turbine has rendered a room unsuitable for living in because of a flicker. If that is the case I am quite upset that wind turbines have forced folk to abandon using rooms, losing a room for the duration of the life of the turbine sounds quite shocking. 

 

I believe I did do a link earlier in this thread, SP. 

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

"And those wind turbines are tiny compared to what is proposed for here.  Interesting to note too that they were built in 1992 yet are being replaced now with larger ones, plus press reports stated that whilst villagers aren't being affected at present, they anticipate they will be with the much larger ones - no wonder you're moving."

 

So, they're reducing the number of turbines from 24 twenty-year old turbines, with eight, larger but more efficient and better designed turbines with increased capacity, and you're still able to find something to complain about? You're consistent, I'll give you that.

 

And you're just as consistent in missing the point, one being that they decided to replace them before they reached 25 years in age.

[paulb]

you did. but you also ignored a persons statement that has had real experience of large scale turbines whether a 1/3 small matters little.  stand under one and you will be impressed at there size. a simple rule the bigger the blades the slower they turn. so less l flicker if any it will be more like a shadow moving than a flicker. something the size of our would produce it but not the very large ones.

[paulb]

 

"And those wind turbines are tiny compared to what is proposed for here.  Interesting to note too that they were built in 1992 yet are being replaced now with larger ones, plus press reports stated that whilst villagers aren't being affected at present, they anticipate they will be with the much larger ones - no wonder you're moving."

 

So, they're reducing the number of turbines from 24 twenty-year old turbines, with eight, larger but more efficient and better designed turbines with increased capacity, and you're still able to find something to complain about? You're consistent, I'll give you that.

 

And you're just as consistent in missing the point, one being that they decided to replace them before they reached 25 years in age.

 

because they produce more power for less turbines and a better built. simple commercial sense.

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

@ paulb - she gave her experiences.  How, incidentally, can you categorically state there will be less flicker from the ones proposed for VE - are they moving all the water in the lochs then?  Doesn't flicker also include a reflection?  Maths too, there's proposed to be more turbines here than the windfarm she is referring to.

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

 

 

"And those wind turbines are tiny compared to what is proposed for here.  Interesting to note too that they were built in 1992 yet are being replaced now with larger ones, plus press reports stated that whilst villagers aren't being affected at present, they anticipate they will be with the much larger ones - no wonder you're moving."

 

So, they're reducing the number of turbines from 24 twenty-year old turbines, with eight, larger but more efficient and better designed turbines with increased capacity, and you're still able to find something to complain about? You're consistent, I'll give you that.

 

And you're just as consistent in missing the point, one being that they decided to replace them before they reached 25 years in age.

 

because they produce more power for less turbines and a better built. simple commercial sense.

 

 

How often do we hear that there will only be X No. wind turbines and they will only be Xft high and no, they won't be any higher ... only for years later, they go ahead and replace them with larger ones?

 

VE has a tight window re making a return.  5 years out of 25 years is quite a chunk.  What we're not being told is the entire story.  Did the old ones go through more gearboxes than anticipated, for example?

 

She also stated that the windfarm wasn't paid for with local money ... so just what benefits did the local community get? 

[paulb]

@ paulb - she gave her experiences.  How, incidentally, can you categorically state there will be less flicker from the ones proposed for VE - are they moving all the water in the lochs then?  Doesn't flicker also include a reflection?  Maths too, there's proposed to be more turbines here than the windfarm she is referring to.

simple physics really. ours spins between 100-200 times a minute in a good wind and produces flicker. a large turbine can not spin fast enough to generate flicker. if they were able to  the sonic bangs may give grounds for complaint. bits of supersonic turbine blade braking off may kill a whimble too.

 

if you lived in calderdale you would know that there are at least 50 within a 5 mile radius of todmorden. replacing older turbines that are less efficent with better ones make sense both commercially and for green reasons. do you keep a 25 year old car on the road just because you own one. or do you buy a better one. the old ones work fine just not efficent enough to compare to the new ones. most modern turbines dont have gear boxes. 

[paulb]

all the ones around tod are owned eithe by power companies or land companies like peel holdings and some are joint ventures between private and semi public bodies. one is owned by a water company.

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

Isn't it the case that VE haven't actually stated what model turbines they are going to actually use?  I can't find a specific model referred to on their website.

[paulb]

i would imagine they will wait to nearer to the time. 2 years before construction begins so at a guess within a year we should hear. there is not too many to choose from. 

[Suffererof1crankymofo]

So essentially, paulb, they could have blades that cause flicker, couldn't they?

 

Have you not seen the video clips available throughout the web showing flicker from the larger wind turbines?

[paulb]

not real flicker as said the blades wont be going fast enough. i could post the maths but i dont think it would help lots of algebra. basically the best generation speed is not at either end of its generation speed. the blades are not flat on so at most you will only see a portion of it. now the location of each turbine and the suns position would indicate that any shadows will be on the northern side of the turbines so we need to know any homes within say 1km of them on the north side of the turbines. the high of the sun will obviously make the shadows longer but then the hours of sunlight are reduced. so a lot of homes like those in aith wont have an issue. hope that helps.

[paulb]

https://www.wind-watch.org/video-wisconsin.php

 

if you mean like this no house in shetland will be any where as close as those.  we need bright sun shine to even get a shadow

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/48052/1416-update-uk-shadow-flicker-evidence-base.pdf

 

beyond 840 meters there wont be any effect.

[paulb]

found this it may help

http://www.vikingenergy.co.uk/assets/files/eia2009/figures-and-images/Figure-9.6.2-Shadow-Flicker-(South).pdf