Sovereign Shetland

[Spinner72]

Just think of the members of the Soveriegn Nation of Shetland like the Masons. They have their own ways (be they fact or fiction) but co-exist with everyone else just fine. They don't need our vote to elect the chief mason or whatever, but are a democracy within themselves.

 

Likewise the members of the Soveriegn Nation of Shetland will have their own ways and democracy, but unless you join, they won't be bothering you.

 

This new society won't exactly be up to much then. The Mason's only strengths are in areas where mainstream society has little or no legislation, or by infiltrating the higher echelons of mainstream society and using those positions, within the constraints of mainstream society's rules, to further their own democracy.

 

That shows why I wanted to keep it a lighthearted analogy - it kinda falls apart when you go too far with it!

 

Again this bring me back to the "why not Forvik" question.

 

The Soveriegn Nation of Forvik would be so much easier to explain and achieve the same aims, indeed the same aim as the initial Forvik project - an experiment in creating a possible second option for society in Shetland, but in "microcosm".

 

As I have always said - I like the idea, but will not be joining as my real life is too committed to the society we have now, however I see no reason people cant watch, and support, from outside, to see how things work out and stand by for

[derick]

 

... Shetland as a whole is fundamentally a mainstream Scottish society based on the well-tested stereotypical Scottish characteristic of Canny Scottery, and any off-that-wall suggestions that it diverge from that model - whether politically like the Irish or culturally like the Welsh - will gain support measurable in points - if not nought-points - of a percent.

 

Correct. Shetlan is basically 'Crieff By the Sea'

Except that Shetlan haes a more conservative trend, as in peerie 'c', as even Small Town Scotland.

 

Hence da British Unionist reactionary uncle tom tendancy, cross-dressed up as Shetland Movement in true last tuesday in January style.

[icepick239]

... Shetland as a whole is fundamentally a mainstream Scottish society based on the well-tested stereotypical Scottish characteristic of Canny Scottery, and any off-that-wall suggestions that it diverge from that model - whether politically like the Irish or culturally like the Welsh - will gain support measurable in points - if not nought-points - of a percent.

Correct. Shetlan is basically 'Crieff By the Sea'

Except that Shetlan haes a more conservative trend, as in peerie 'c', as even Small Town Scotland.

Hence da British Unionist reactionary uncle tom tendancy, cross-dressed up as Shetland Movement in true last tuesday in January style.

Hey Soos, tik it easy guys - we dinna a hae the benefit o Brian's education

[Gorgonzola Butt-cheese]

Well it seems the conference has sparked quite a bit if debate even before it has begun.

I dont know what can be achieved from it, maybe nothing, maybe something.

In any case I am going to go and listen to whats being said and maybe even add my views and concerns on particular issues.

I hope their is a good turn out and that will require people with opposing points of view to stimulate the debate.

[GeorgeK]

I can't believe people are seriously considering this. The harassment i received over my Dolphin Pool was thoroughly humiliating.

 

Yet i stand proud, in the belief that soon my pool will become a reality. Unlike this self-governing hogwash by some 'Sooth Moother', who has the audacity to come up to the Shetlands and tell us how to arrange our political affairs!

[paulb]

Well it seems the conference has sparked quite a bit if debate even before it has begun.

I dont know what can be achieved from it, maybe nothing, maybe something.

In any case I am going to go and listen to whats being said and maybe even add my views and concerns on particular issues.

I hope their is a good turn out and that will require people with opposing points of view to stimulate the debate.

have you seen the speakers bios.

health is being covered by a cleaner (nothing wrong being a cleaner by the way0

[paulb]

I can't believe people are seriously considering this. The harassment i received over my Dolphin Pool was thoroughly humiliating.

 

Yet i stand proud, in the belief that soon my pool will become a reality. Unlike this self-governing hogwash by some 'Sooth Moother', who has the audacity to come up to the Shetlands and tell us how to arrange our political affairs!

you mean your trained dolphins are not seakers.

[MuckleD]

Good God,

just checked the forum and can't believe how far words can be twisted!

 

So much has been misinterpreted, arms and legs added and nonsense stirred in.

 

I could spend and eternity going in circles on this forum trying to correct slanderous, malicious comments. There are too many to even make a start now.

 

Happy muck slinging.

 

Enjoy the silence.

[Ghostrider]

^^ Misinterpretation and assumptions leading to speculation can almost always be traced back to there only being badly presented, lacking in adequate detail, incomplete or ambigious information available on the core subject.

 

For the purposes of any debate on sovereignty as it applies in a Shetland context, the Sovereign Shetland website is the sole source of information. For matters of sovereignty in general or specific to other nations, there is no way or verifying on a limited timescale what of it is kosher, and what of it is simply blowing in the wind. And in any case, even when you have skimmed off the cream, it still requires to be applied and considered with Shetland specifics factored in.

 

IMHO the Sovereign Shetland website is very guilty of lacking adequate detail, and is significantly incomplete, so it is little wonder misinterpretation and erronous assumptions are rife.

 

The core message which comes out of the Sovereign Shetland website is that anyone who chooses can "opt out" of the current Shetland society, can create and live within a new society, and the current Shetland society will be powerless to prevent them from doing so.

 

I'm not denying that it isn't, theoretically at least, possible to do so, but to be blunt, it simply does not compute when you try to envison it in practice on the information currently readily available.

 

There is nothing (as far as I have been able to find) on the Sovereign Shetland website to give a clue, never mind explain, how or why the current Shetland society will be powerless to prevent anyone who wishes to leave their's and join a new Shetland society from doing so. In the absence of any such information folk will try and figure it out for themselves, it is commonplace and simply self-preservation that a large number of people prefer to "look before they leap". Jumping in to a new society without being as sure as they can be that they're bolting the door behind them securely, so that the old society can't sneak up behind them and haul them back through it, is something a lot of folk at least will insist on before making any move. In the absence of the information on how to achieve it being provided to them, they will attempt to figure out themselves how to fill that information void, with the predictable quantity of useless and irrelevant material that looking for a needle in a haystack inevitably produces, being churned out while it is a work in progress.

 

As you said before, too many people still misunderstand the situation, and that misunderstanding IMHO is a direct result of enough information having been put forth by Sovereign Shetland to get folk's attention, but so far wholly omitting to divulge numerous details which are vital to know before a judgement call can be made on the subject.

 

Sovereign Shetland assumedly put this in the public arena to garner support and growth, unless they also put forth enough information to "sell" the scheme as well, its going noplace.

 

Personally I'm already finding the whole things more than just a little irritating, it all sounds too much like telesales tactics for my liking, vague and ambigious promises, but not real information or details of how or when they will materialise,

[icepick239]

Day 1 of the Sovereign Conference at the Museum.

Why was there NO reports online, from either the Shetland Times or the The Shetland News?

[NewMagnie]

Day 1 of the Sovereign Conference at the Museum.

Why was there NO reports online, from either the Shetland Times or the The Shetland News?

 

Possibly because the whole exercise is futile, irrellevant and irretrievably dull?

 

Mind you, that's never stopped the Times before.

 

@Ghost "IMHO the Sovereign Shetland website is very guilty of lacking adequate detail, and is significantly incomplete, so it is little wonder misinterpretation and erronous assumptions are rife."

 

You're dead right - all rhetoric and no content. I do find the concept intriguing, but only on an academic level. Unfortunately SS.com addresses neither the practical or the theoretical concepts to any acceptable level.

[NewMagnie]

[

The sovereignty of Shetland has recently (thanks mainly to Stuart) been shown to still exist, and is only held in check by the apathy, ignorance and cowardice of the general population.

 

Current "management" will not "let us away" with anything. We will do as we are lawfully entitled to do and it is they who will have to like it or lump it.

 

We'll do as we're lawfully entitled to and they'll lump it?

 

Yeah, good luck with that. I think you'll find that Saddam Hussein's final diary entry read something like that.

 

As for the apathy and cowardice of the general population - you're making that accusation on the basis of not jumping on board this particular, petty nationalist, jingo laden, separatist bandwagon? Good for you. You've really got our number.

[EM]

Day 1 of the Sovereign Conference at the Museum.

Why was there NO reports online, from either the Shetland Times or the The Shetland News?

 

Possibly because the whole exercise is futile, irrellevant and irretrievably dull?

That may be so, but I think it is more due to icepick239 having a wonky calender. As far as I'm aware it hasn't started yet.

[Brian]

Day 1 of the Sovereign Conference at the Museum.

Why was there NO reports online, from either the Shetland Times or the The Shetland News?

 

Maybe because you got the date wrong?

[icepick239]

Ooops! At least 2 of you noticed my "deliberate error"

Mind you, one other didn't.

This is what happens, when you read the Times, Bin-it and then take of to the Sooth.

Cheers