Mareel - Cinema & Music Venue

[JustMe]

Welll I am tempted to think that a bowling alley and an ice rink would be a better use for the money even though I would be more likely to use the new venue. And all is not yet lost. The objectors can still call for a judicial review of their claim that this is public money being used in competition against the existing owners of venues.

 

My hope is that anything like that is done quickly as delay is good for no one.

[NewMagnie]

I've not got the details but the report went through Council yesterday. So it looks like the CMV is going to get built.

 

Also, has anybody seen a petition with any more than a couple of names on it?

 

 

 

Apathy rules.

 

I guess most people are resigned to the council doing what they want.

 

All I hope is they don't make an ass of it (see Library, Museum etc etc)

 

Practically a certainty.

 

£7.5m on a pointless gewgaw to satisfy the vanity of the urbanite chattering classes seems to be the icing on the cake. The £13m for Lerwick housing is an admission of the Council's de facto abandonment of the rural areas. Both of these sums would be better spent on developing industries there and filling the houses that are already lying void.

 

I've always tried to avoid looking at this in a sort of predictable toon vs country sort of way but my inner Unst man is finally winnin' oot. I can't see this project in isolation any more, it's symptomatic of a general failure to be able to see beyond the (soon to be bloated) boundaries of Lerwick.

[McFly]

Apathy rules.

 

Or maybe the majority want it?

[JustMe]

New Magnie wrote

£7.5m on a pointless gewgaw to satisfy the vanity of the urbanite chattering classes seems to be the icing on the cake. The £13m for Lerwick housing is an admission of the Council's de facto abandonment of the rural areas. Both of these sums would be better spent on developing industries there and filling the houses that are already lying void.

 

Sorry but I do not agree with the above statement. The new venue could only be sited in Lerwick simply because the town not only has by far the biggest population but is also relatively convenient for large chunks of the remaining population. Sorry about Unst but do I understand that films and other events will get brought to rural areas from the base of the new venue.

 

The proposed £13m to be spent on housing in Lerwick reflects public demand and the council has a track record of assisting development of new industries in rural areas. If anything perhaps a bit too much money on some ventures.

 

Empty houses of course reflect the public's desire not to live in those areas but it seems to me that the council could make it known to people on the waiting list for Lerwick that they could be considered for the tenancy of these empty houses. In fact the way SIC housing runs the waiting list means that applicants can choose just 3 areas where they would like to live......and the town is divided into at least 3 areas so they cannot choose say Lerwick, Scalloway or Sandwick which is not a goos way to let rural properties.

[Marvin]

 

Sorry but I do not agree with the above statement. The new venue could only be sited in Lerwick simply because the town not only has by far the biggest population but is also relatively convenient for large chunks of the remaining population. Sorry about Unst but do I understand that films and other events will get brought to rural areas from the base of the new venue.

 

The proposed £13m to be spent on housing in Lerwick reflects public demand and the council has a track record of assisting development of new industries in rural areas. If anything perhaps a bit too much money on some ventures.

 

Empty houses of course reflect the public's desire not to live in those areas but it seems to me that the council could make it known to people on the waiting list for Lerwick that they could be considered for the tenancy of these empty houses. In fact the way SIC housing runs the waiting list means that applicants can choose just 3 areas where they would like to live......and the town is divided into at least 3 areas so they cannot choose say Lerwick, Scalloway or Sandwick which is not a goos way to let rural properties.

 

Very good points, well made.

[Marvin]

 

Or maybe the majority want it?

 

Yes, I think so. I have not come across much resistance from anywhere except on this forum.

[NewMagnie]

 

Sorry but I do not agree with the above statement. The new venue could only be sited in Lerwick simply because the town not only has by far the biggest population but is also relatively convenient for large chunks of the remaining population. Sorry about Unst but do I understand that films and other events will get brought to rural areas from the base of the new venue.

 

The proposed £13m to be spent on housing in Lerwick reflects public demand and the council has a track record of assisting development of new industries in rural areas. If anything perhaps a bit too much money on some ventures.

 

Empty houses of course reflect the public's desire not to live in those areas but it seems to me that the council could make it known to people on the waiting list for Lerwick that they could be considered for the tenancy of these empty houses. In fact the way SIC housing runs the waiting list means that applicants can choose just 3 areas where they would like to live......and the town is divided into at least 3 areas so they cannot choose say Lerwick, Scalloway or Sandwick which is not a goos way to let rural properties.

 

... which implies that it should be built at all which now seems to be taken as a given. As far as I'm concerned, the case still has to be made.

 

Insofar as the public's desire to live in Lerwick goes - its a circular argument. I'm aware of plenty of people from country areas living in or around the town out of economic necessity rather than desire. I wouldn't blame public bodies entirely for this urban drift, its an international phenomenon after all - but their policies don't exactly mitigate against it.

[shetlander]

Now I’m neither from the town or in favour of the Council spending the sums of money proposed for the new Cinema and Music Venue. I do however recognise that if it does go ahead, Lerwick is the best place for it and that it will be an amenity for everyone in Shetland to enjoy, albeit that those furthest from it will have less opportunity to use it to the same extent as folk in the town. Given the current housing crisis, I very much support the Council using its reserves to fund the building of new public housing in the Lerwick. Certainly, the various public agencies in Shetland should be encouraging development and folk to stay in rural areas but if they choose to want to live in Lerwick regardless of that, ways of housing them have to be found.

 

Having said all that, I can certainly see your viewpoint New Magnie. Last week I was shocked to read just how much the pupil numbers at the Baltasound School are expected to fall in the next year or two which really brought home the massive effect the departure of the RAF must be having and how worrying a time it must be for everyone in Unst. I sincerely hope that you get as much help as possible in trying to fill the void the RAF will undoubtedly leave.

 

I know I’m digressing from the subject of this thread here but the issue about depopulation and young folk leaving the more remote parts of Shetland is a big one. Unfortunately though, I don’ t think that developing local industries will (in itself at least) do the trick. Looking at how population levels have fallen in the remoter parts of Shetland in recent years you would be forgiven for thinking that the Council and others have been sitting back and doing nothing for decades while nothing could be further from the truth. Everywhere has (and continues to) benefit immensely from hugely subsidised high quality council amenities and services such as ferries, care and leisure facilities, schools etc (as well as the jobs they provide) and fairly generous grants for local industries. All of this means that the Council has created almost as favourable an economic background as is possible given the locational constraints of some places to try to keep young folk and create businesses. To be honest, I’m at a loss as to just how much more they can do, especially given their financial problems at the moment.

 

The root of the problem as I see it is a societal as opposed to an economic change over the last 30 or so years. There have been big social, transport, communication and educational changes offering young folk from remoter areas a wealth of new opportunities which simply didn’t exist before - there are increased opportunities to go on to do further or higher education meaning the jobs commonly created in local industries are not suitable for them when they return. Or some folk want to leave simply to experience a new way of life elsewhere, whether that be in Lerwick or further afield. From my own point of view, I choose to live where I do through a combination of the lifestyle I have here and job opportunities in the field in which I graduated and I can’t see myself returning to where I grew up in one of the isles (in the short term at least) for those reasons. I think the same is the case for many young folk who decide to leave. Of course employment creation (including unskilled jobs in traditional sectors) should be encouraged but I don’t think that on its own is going to either keep or attract folk back to some places in Shetland – I won’t pretend to have the answers but decentralisation of Council jobs, encouraging the employment of graduates in traditional industries like fish farming or in renewables (sales, marketing, quality control, engineering etc), or a graduate return grant scheme could certainly help.

 

I don’t mean to paint a bleak picture here and I’m certainly not suggesting that the lights are put out and the door is closed on places like Unst. I do think we have to stop and ask why young folk leave rather than assume that developing industries is on its own going to fix the problem – a lot of it is simply down to young folk taking up choices and opportunities which simply didn’t exist before.

[NewMagnie]

Shetlander and JustMe - nobody is suggesting it be built anywhere else but Lerwick. I'm suggesting that it shouldn't be built at all.

 

I'm intensely aware of the level of council expenditure in rural areas - and in Lerwick for that matter. The roads network and ferry service is nothing short of amazing given the size of the isles, the network of schools, care centres and leisure centres are often the only thing that makes life sustainable in certain areas and that provision is to be applauded. This is all good stuff; but you don't measure the depth of a hole by looking at the pile of earth.

 

If people are still leaving in spite of this investment, it doesn't mean that they're turning their noses up and capering off to the bright lights regardless, it means that it isn't enough. While all of those provide jobs, there still aren't enough to go round. As far as investment in the private sector goes, fine and well but even the salmon industry doesn't require the manpower it used to.

 

The only mass employer of graduate staff is the council. Given the investment in housing and premises across the isles why not take it to its logical conclusion and utilise it through a process of decentralisation? There's a value argument here - why abandon housing and offices and plough public cash into building more in Lerwick?

 

You point out that the council's resources are more stretched than they used to be: how do you reconcile that with condoning the abondonment of valuable resources and spending scarce cash on fripperies like the CMV?

[shetlander]

I don't disagree with anything you have said New Magnie and (as I said in my last post) I both oppose the new CMV and would very much be in favour of the decentralisation of Council jobs to places outwith Lerwick for the reasons you have stated.

 

I suppose the point I was trying to get across in my post though was that sometimes even jobs (and graduate jobs at that) aren't enough to encourage young folk to stay or come back to a place. Thats not, of course, a reason not to do everything possible to try to create employment in remoter parts of Shetland but we should recognise that in some cases, social factors have a bigger part to play in peoples choices on where to stay than economic ones, limiting the ability of agencies such as the Council or Shetland Enterprise to reverse patterns of depopulation.

[dB]

Apathy rules.

 

Or maybe the majority want it?

 

 

 

Trust me - a huge majority DON'T want it but cannot or will not say so. Why can't BBC Radio Shetland go walkabout and ask the "man in the street" to choose either

 

a. Go ahead as proposed

b. Go ahead but scale it down a bit

c. Don't go ahead, there's enough provision as is

 

or something like that.

 

As long as both sides agree that the questions aren't weighted I would find it very interesting to get the views from a large cross section of Shetland's population - young/old, toon/country/isles.

 

I know one thing - the figures in the business plan are totally unattainable.

[dB]

 

Or maybe the majority want it?

 

Yes, I think so. I have not come across much resistance from anywhere except on this forum.

 

 

Du needs to get oot more Marvin.

 

Only jesting - I reckon about 20 to 1 in favour of NOT going ahead of the people I speak to.

 

Guess we must frequent different places.

[JustMe]

db wrote

Trust me - a huge majority DON'T want it but cannot or will not say so. Why can't BBC Radio Shetland go walkabout and ask the "man in the street" to choose either

 

a. Go ahead as proposed

b. Go ahead but scale it down a bit

c. Don't go ahead, there's enough provision as is

 

Wonder how many "What Venue?"s they would get. Not everybody reads the times or listens to local radio (or visits Shetlink).

[JustMe]

db wrote

Trust me - a huge majority DON'T want it but cannot or will not say so. Why can't BBC Radio Shetland go walkabout and ask the "man in the street" to choose either

 

a. Go ahead as proposed

b. Go ahead but scale it down a bit

c. Don't go ahead, there's enough provision as is

 

Wonder how many "What Venue?"s they would get. Not everybody reads the times or listens to local radio (or visits Shetlink).

 

Have I pressed the right buttons this time?.

[JustMe]

Newmagnie wrote

The only mass employer of graduate staff is the council. Given the investment in housing and premises across the isles why not take it to its logical conclusion and utilise it through a process of decentralisation? There's a value argument here - why abandon housing and offices and plough public cash into building more in Lerwick?

 

Given that some thought and it wont work. Moving SIC jobs to rural areas will mean SIC staff commuting to those areas. And even if they dont choose to commute I fear that it would be hard for SIC to recruit staff with the qualifications and experience the council would want.